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swingman

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QB: Croft (3rd year)/Rhoda (5th year)/Green (2nd year)/Morgan (1st year)freshman Estes? walk on frosh Pickerign,Roste
RB: Smith (4th year)/Brooks (3rd year)/McCrary (4th year)/FemiCole (3rd year)freshmen Ibrahim, London; walkon Knox
WR: Carter (5th year)/Holland (4th year)/Register? (3rd year)walk on Morse? freshman Autman-Bell
WR: Still (3rd year)/Howard? (2nd year)/Gentry? (4th year)/walk on Reger? freshmen Douglas and Van Dyne
WR: Tyler Johnson (2nd year)/Hmielewski? (2nd year)/Williams?(2nd year)walk on Geary? walk on frosh Annexstad?
TE: Lingen (4th year)/Wozniak (5th year)/Beebe (3rd year)/Witham(3rd year) Kieft (2), frosh Umlor, Bursch, Paulson
Tackle: Greene (4th year)/Oseland (3rd year)freshman Andries
Guard: Calhoun (4th year)/Schlueter (2nd year) walk on rs jr Just, walk on Ruschmeyer
Center: Weyler (4th year)/Olson (2nd year)freshman Schmitz
Guard: Dovich (3rd year)/Davis (2nd year)freshman walk on Rousemiller
Tackle: Wright (5th year)/Connelly (3rd year) freshman Sassack

12 returning with starting experience Smith, Brooks, Carter, Still, Johnson, Lingen, Wozniak, Beebe, Greene, Calhoun, Weyler, Wright...13 if you count Rhoda at Maryland.

Safety: McGhee (5th year)/Huff (3rd year)/freshman HandyHolly
Safety: Winfield (2nd year)/Ayinde (5th year)/ freshman Beck
Corner: Kiondre (2nd year)/Harris (1st year)/Durr injury?/Winfield flex?
Corner: Shenault (3rd year)/Craighton (3rd year)/Estes position change?
Walk on dbs Cooper, Dipre, Wieland, Swenson
Linebacker; Celestin (4th year)/Cashman (3rd year)/Huff/walk on Schoenfelder
Linebacker: Poock (4th year)/Barber (2nd year)/Williams (4th year)
Linebacker: Martin (2nd year)/Waters (3rd year)/walk on Weber
Rush End; Coughlin (2nd year)/Devers (2nd year)fresh Guthrie/frshman Mafe
Tackle: Richardson (4th year)/Merrick (5th year) juco Silver, freshman Robinson
Tackle: Stelter (4th year)/Moore (4th year) freshman Hickcox, freshman Schirck
Def End: DeLattiboudere (3rd year)/Gibson (4th year)/freshman Otomewo

9 return with starting experience McGhee, Winfield, Ayinde, Shenault, Celestin, Poock, Richardson, Stelter, DeLattiboudere (plus Coughlin, Martin each got a start last year; Williams had 2 starts in 15, 1 in 14)

Punter: Santoso (5th year)/Herbers (3rd year)/Ryerse
Snapper: Jordahl (4th year)/Hansen (3rd year)/walk on Hanson
PR: Shenault did some

Kicker: Carpenter (4th year)/Santoso (5th year)/Juenneman/Mack/Ryerse
KR: Smith? Brooks?

lot of returning starters, lot of returning two deepers, lot of 3rd, 4th, 5th year guys...nice group of freshmen coming in

Very good at RB, TE, not bad at oline really, have some nice prospects at Wr, QB a question but some options
Very good at DT, LB, be nice to add a cover corner or two (miss Buford, Hardin) and a big defensive end or two (miss Elmore, Hank as rs senior), a big safety or two would be nice (Dior, the juco Sawvel had recruited)
Special teams in good shape
 


If the Gophers can develop someone at QB and CB I think there is enough talent everywhere else to have a pretty good season. I'm not buying the rebuilding or 6-6 argument but that's just me. :)
 




I stopped reading after it said this was Green's 3rd year.
 


John Galt said:
I stopped reading after it said this was Green's 3rd year.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the catch. Following Seth for so long since early offer, early Oregon commit, early enroll it is hard to believe still a true frosh.
 

This recap shows, what I've always believed, there's enough quality players to have a good year. It will all depend on development at the QB position. PJ may have his own system, that's different then the previous staffs, but the raw material is pretty good. I don't see a grace period, PJ needs to have results, similar to what was posted last year. Division and conference champs may be in the future, but it has to start, by not going backwards.
 



nsmike said:
This recap shows, what I've always believed, there's enough quality players to have a good year. It will all depend on development at the QB position. JP may have his own system, that's different then the previous staffs, but the raw material is pretty good. I don't see a grace period, JP needs to have results, similar to what was posted last year. Division and conference champs may be in the future, but it has to start, by not going backwards.
Click to expand...

Do you have dyslexia?
 



I'm not sure these numbers mean as much as folks want them to...
 





I don't think anyone has argued that our team is really young. The argument is more about how much depth and talent we have.

Your information is disingenuous at best and flat out lying at worst. While it's technically true that Greene and Calhoun are in their 4th years and Wright is a 5th year senior, Calhoun and Wright have been on the team for just over a year, and Greene has been on campus for about 7 months. You list Weyler as a 4th year starting center even though to my knowledge he's never taken a snap at center. He played guard before he got injured last year and missed all of spring practice. It seems like you are working overtime to support your narrative that we have a lot of depth and experience.
 

I think we are somewhere in between. We got some depth, we got some experience. We have some guys who appear able to step in and help. But we have a new coaching staff and a new system too, even if we had 22 returning starters. So, there are plenty of unknowns. But, the schedule in the first 7 games is conquerable. We could start fast. It's not hopeless and far more optimistic to me it'll come together than spiral outta control.
I do believe we do have an excellent staff and they'll get results from they have to work with. It's fun to watch it happen.
 

I think John is right. The Gophers are at a great disadvantage compared to all the teams that are returning every player from last year.

Seriously - name a team in college sports that doesn't have at least some turnover from year to year. players graduate - they transfer - teams bring in recruits - they bring in JUCO's - players who were red-shirted join the active roster.

The Gophers are no different than most college FB teams. They have some areas of strength, and they have some areas of concern and/or inexperience. And yes, they have a new coaching staff. But, like most teams, the Gophers have Spring practice, off-season summer conditioning, and Fall practice to prepare before they have to play a game. That should be enough time to learn the new systems and integrate new players into the lineup.

I am NOT saying I expect the Gophers to win X number of games. Frankly, I just don't know what to think. They could look great this fall - or they could stink up the joint - and neither outcome would surprise me.

But - if the Gophers do not have a good season, I honestly do not think that "depth" will be the primary reason.
 

The only depth thing I'm concerned about for this year is DB. One or two injuries at CB will be catastrophic for the team.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
I think John is right. The Gophers are at a great disadvantage compared to all the teams that are returning every player from last year.

Seriously - name a team in college sports that doesn't have at least some turnover from year to year. players graduate - they transfer - teams bring in recruits - they bring in JUCO's - players who were red-shirted join the active roster.

The Gophers are no different than most college FB teams. They have some areas of strength, and they have some areas of concern and/or inexperience. And yes, they have a new coaching staff. But, like most teams, the Gophers have Spring practice, off-season summer conditioning, and Fall practice to prepare before they have to play a game. That should be enough time to learn the new systems and integrate new players into the lineup.

I am NOT saying I expect the Gophers to win X number of games. Frankly, I just don't know what to think. They could look great this fall - or they could stink up the joint - and neither outcome would surprise me.

But - if the Gophers do not have a good season, I honestly do not think that "depth" will be the primary reason.
Click to expand...

No one is predicting the apocalypse, and I think everyone would be disappointed with less than 7 wins. 7-9 is the most likely scenario imo. What I continue to argue against is the notion that we should be building off last season and 9+ wins is expected or PJ hasn't done a good job...
 

John Galt said:
No one is predicting the apocalypse, and I think everyone would be disappointed with less than 7 wins. 7-9 is the most likely scenario imo. What I continue to argue against is the notion that we should be building off last season and 9+ wins is expected or PJ hasn't done a good job...
Click to expand...

To me, one of the more crucial and less discussed factors in how good of a season the Rodents have next year is how far the three Juco OL come along by August; Greene, Calhoun, and Wright. They were okay last year, but a second year out of Juco, I'm hoping for them to make a considerable step forward or things could get tough. All 3 probably came in heavier than they need to be so we'll see how that progresses by fall as well.
 

We should definitely be building off of last season.
Will that equate to more wins? Maybe, maybe not.
We have experience and depth at some positions and we also have unknowns and little depth at others. How quickly the new freshman acclimate to college football in the BIG will go a long way to filling in those depth issues, along with staying healthy at some key spots, like CB and OL.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
The only depth thing I'm concerned about for this year is DB. One or two injuries at CB will be catastrophic for the team.
Click to expand...

I would add O-Line to that mix as well. Have seen a decimated unit here in the spring and while some of the experienced guys are likely to be healthy in the fall it won't take much for the rotation to get really short again.

In the end though it all really hinges on the QB position. If we get solid play from that spot the team has a good chance of being solid, if the QB play is spotty the offense could really struggle.
 

John Galt said:
No one is predicting the apocalypse, and I think everyone would be disappointed with less than 7 wins. 7-9 is the most likely scenario imo. What I continue to argue against is the notion that we should be building off last season and 9+ wins is expected or PJ hasn't done a good job...
Click to expand...

Agree with your take JG. I think most everyone on the board thinks that win range. I think the issue that some have pointed out is that this should not be a rebuilding year with the talent on the roster. While it's not bullet proof there is a decent amount of skill all over and you combine that with a weaker schedule (on paper) and no one thinks that 5-6 wins should happen (some have predicted that and sound ok with that) and that would be a disappointment in my eyes. I think the coaching staff is way too good to let that happen. That being said I don't think anyone is expecting to win the west this year.. I personally think to make that push QB play and CB play will be key. I honestly think that Warriner will make that line play well and zone blocking will be fantastic for our RBs. Regardless it's going to be fun!
 

John Galt said:
No one is predicting the apocalypse, and I think everyone would be disappointed with less than 7 wins. 7-9 is the most likely scenario imo. What I continue to argue against is the notion that we should be building off last season and 9+ wins is expected or PJ hasn't done a good job...
Click to expand...

I think most of the people who talked about winning 9 plus games this season were more mocking Coyle's press conference than having that expectation.

IMO, your expectations are completely reasonable (7-9 wins). I wouldn't even categorically say that PJ didn't do a good job if we went 6-6.

As far as experience, I guess it's better to have your 4th or 5th year players always be original FR recruits, but a JR or SR who went to JuCO is more experienced (IMO) than a FR or SO. They are older. They've played more football.

As far as depth, we are decent at some spots and thin at other (WR, CB, OL).
 

GFBfan said:
We should definitely be building off of last season.
Will that equate to more wins? Maybe, maybe not.
We have experience and depth at some positions and we also have unknowns and little depth at others. How quickly the new freshman acclimate to college football in the BIG will go a long way to filling in those depth issues, along with staying healthy at some key spots, like CB and OL.
Click to expand...

What does "building off last season" even mean if it doesn't equate to more wins?
 

Last year we had a fifth year senior in Pirsig, the three jucos (Greene, Wright, and Calhoun), a third year sophomore in Weyler, a second year sophomore in Moore as the core of our offensive line.

We return four of those six. Those four should be more seasoned, better conditioned, less prone to injury, stronger, and better coached. Some of those were playing hurt and have now had clean-up surgeries- that should help.

Replacing Pirsig is a question mark, but I think they have plenty of candidates at tackles up to coming at least close to the task.

I am confident we can replace Moore with one of Olson, Schmitz, Davis or Weyler.

We had four depth guys in Mayes, Oseland, Connelly and Dovich. Three of those four return.

We return 7 of top 10. I am not convinced two of the three we lose would be starters if they stayed.

We add two redshirt frosh in Olson and Schlueter.

Previous staff and this staff both really like Olson. Olson almost had redshirt pulled last year.

Schlueter is a high end recruit offered by Wisconsin, Michigan State, Northwestern, Louisville, Iowa State before he committed way early (April of his junior year).

We add a handpicked juco by Warinner, arguably one of the top oline coaches and recruiters in all of football.

We add one of our most heralded recruits ever in Andries, and two hand-picked Fleck guys in Sassack (Big Ten and SEC offers) and Schmitz (number one ranked center in midwest).

We take the redshirt off a juco walk on with very good size.

If someone can present an objective, logical reasoned argument that doesn't conclude we will have a better, deeper, more experienced o-line, please do so.

And make sure you factor in that the tight ends assist the oline and ALL the tight ends return and we add a redshirt and three frosh and a tight end coach who was co-oline national coach of the year last year.

Plus, you have to factor in running backs can help make an oline look better and we return our top three (all physically mature and experienced), plus have a fourth that looked very solid on Saturday and we add two more frosh rbs. Fleck said the one is like Barry Sanders and Christian Okoye. The new coach has already stepped up the running backs games in 14 weeks.

Plus, you have to figure in an offensive scheme that doesn't allow the defense to out number your offensive line in the box every play has to help.

And, you have to figure the combination of Fleck and Simon will develop at least three wide receivers better than what we had last year. We lose only Woli...return all others, add bunch more, remove three red-shirts.

And, you have to factor in how much better motivated the offensive line will be by this staff. It is a position where that intangible is especially significant. The level of discipline and organization should also be going way up, two other key intangibles in o-line play.

If we can only find a qb who can complete more than 56% with better TD/INT ratio than 8 to 12 who can run better than 3 yards per carry...look out.
 


Still an asterisk season if we don't beat Iowa and Wisconsin... [emoji57] [emoji56] [emoji41] ***
 

swingman said:
If someone can present an objective, logical reasoned argument that doesn't conclude we will have a better, deeper, more experienced o-line, please do so.
Click to expand...

First off I will say that our o-line coaching is likely to be the best it has been since at least the Mason days so I'll agree with you there.

You left off the loss of Connor Mayes who played in all 13 games and started 6. So we lost 3 of our top 7 lineman as Mayes would have either been a starter or a primary backup this year.

Our rushing offense was ranked 101st in the country by S&P even with Smith and Brooks totaling 1800 yards. A big portion of their yardage came from them making something out of nothing. We were stopped repeatedly on short yardage situations when our line could not generate any push. We could not run the ball vs the best teams in the west - Iowa, Nebraska, and Wisconsin.

All of that was with our two best offensive lineman - Moore and Pirsig who are now gone. Recruiting and developing offensive lineman was a huge issue with the previous staff and I think that is just as much of a talent issue as anything. I don't think the coaching was that bad, and it isn't the only reason why the Gophers have not had an offensive lineman drafted in the last 10 years. Based on that it's hard for me to believe the young guys who have redshirted will be significantly better. Claeys and Miller were looking for more Jucos for a reason.

It's hard to rely on true Freshman offensive and defensive lineman. Those are the positions you want to redshirt more than any other position. I think Blaise will contribute, but I wouldn't count on many of the Freshman being ready.
 

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