STrib: Decision on Gophers' starting QB might keep until fall

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per Joe:

The Gophers quarterback battle probably won’t be decided during spring football camp, based on comments from coach P.J. Fleck and offensive coordinator Kirk Ciarrocca.

“I doubt it’ll be settled by the end of spring ball, but I think we’ll have a better idea of who’s really in this race,” Ciarrocca said Tuesday.

Conor Rhoda and Demry Croft appear to be the leading contenders, judging from who’s been getting the first reps in the various drills. Seth Green and Tanner Morgan are two others in the running.

“Really, I’m staying very open-minded at this point in time,” Ciarrocca said. “We’re still in that evaluation stage of letting them make mistakes. And then, do they make the same mistake again? Do they learn from it and grow?”

Ciarrocca runs a spread offense featuring the run-pass option, which forces the quarterback to make several quick decisions. He estimates that about 60 percent of the offense has been installed.

Beyond learning a new system, the Gophers have been working with a skeleton offensive line. For the past two practices, they’ve had only four healthy offensive linemen, which has prevented them from doing any full-speed, 11-on-11 drills.

http://www.startribune.com/decision-on-gophers-starting-qb-might-keep-until-fall/418298973/

Go Gophers!!
 

Makes sense to wait as long as possible to name a starter.
Looks like it will come down to Croft or Rhoda for starter and Green and Morgan for the number 3 spot.
 

PJ outright said you need a lot of time with these guys to even have a clue... so makes sense that just springtime wouldn't be enough.
 

What position will Claeys' JC guy end up at? Safety? OLB?
 





beavergopher said:
What position will Claeys' JC guy end up at? Safety? OLB?
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Is that even a realistic option? I haven't seen him play at all, so I don't know what kind of build/athletic ability he has.

I feel really bad for him. You can argue he should have known Claeys could be terminated based on the scandal, but he probably still didn't expect it. And even if he did, he probably expected to at least get a shot. I'm not sure he really has so far. I wouldn't have been surprised to see him start next year had Claeys remained (especially since Rhoda was gone) or at least be in the top two/three. Now he's not even buried on the chart he's basically not even on the chart.

Can he transfer this summer without having to sit a year if the U grants him a release? Unless there's something else going on behind the scenes where they are planning on switching positions or he is higher in the chart and they want to keep it a secret I just can't imagine the U would care if he left. I'm just not sure how the transfer rules work for JC transfers...
 

One of my QB questions - will this staff be more willing to pull a QB who is not having a good day? IF the QB's are relatively close in terms of talent, and knowledge of the offense, I hope the new staff is more flexible. one of my pet peeves with the previous staff was that they would never make a change at QB no matter how bad the starter was playing.

In baseball, if the starter is struggling, you go to the bullpen. In Hockey, if the Goalie gives up a couple of soft goals, you yank him and put in the backup. But FB coaches just seem so reluctant to make a change at QB, no matter how bad the starter is stinkin' up the joint. I've never figured that out.
 




short ornery norwegian said:
One of my QB questions - will this staff be more willing to pull a QB who is not having a good day? IF the QB's are relatively close in terms of talent, and knowledge of the offense, I hope the new staff is more flexible. one of my pet peeves with the previous staff was that they would never make a change at QB no matter how bad the starter was playing.

In baseball, if the starter is struggling, you go to the bullpen. In Hockey, if the Goalie gives up a couple of soft goals, you yank him and put in the backup. But FB coaches just seem so reluctant to make a change at QB, no matter how bad the starter is stinkin' up the joint. I've never figured that out.
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football isn't baseball or hockey. Usually the starting QB is starting for a reason - he's the best player.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
One of my QB questions - will this staff be more willing to pull a QB who is not having a good day? IF the QB's are relatively close in terms of talent, and knowledge of the offense, I hope the new staff is more flexible. one of my pet peeves with the previous staff was that they would never make a change at QB no matter how bad the starter was playing.

In baseball, if the starter is struggling, you go to the bullpen. In Hockey, if the Goalie gives up a couple of soft goals, you yank him and put in the backup. But FB coaches just seem so reluctant to make a change at QB, no matter how bad the starter is stinkin' up the joint. I've never figured that out.
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Good point - I've often wondered about that. If you are doing a lot of passing, pulling a QB having a bad day makes sense if the back-up can pass. If mostly a run-ball control offense, you wouldn't, because you'd want the leadership and timing of the starter. Call Stoll had that problem when he had two QBs in the late '70s, one could pass (Mark Carlson), the other was more of a runner (Wendell Avery). Stoll rotated them.
 



John Galt said:
football isn't baseball or hockey. Usually the starting QB is starting for a reason - he's the best player.
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And pulling your QB, one that you plan on giving most of the reps to, is a great way to destroy his confidence. Also much harder to get into a rhythm when he is getting pulled and put back into the game. I'd much rather they choose a promising QB and just stick with him then pull him after he makes a few bad throws.
 

die hard gopher said:
And pulling your QB, one that you plan on giving most of the reps to, is a great way to destroy his confidence. Also much harder to get into a rhythm when he is getting pulled and put back into the game. I'd much rather they choose a promising QB and just stick with him then pull him after he makes a few bad throws.
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Mostly agree. I will say that there are times when I think it is good to pull the starter out for a series or so and point out some things. Sometimes it comes down to the starter's "make-up". Are they one that can handle being pulled? Will it motivate them? Or as has been pointed out, will it crush the QB's confidence?
 

short ornery norwegian said:
One of my QB questions - will this staff be more willing to pull a QB who is not having a good day? IF the QB's are relatively close in terms of talent, and knowledge of the offense, I hope the new staff is more flexible. one of my pet peeves with the previous staff was that they would never make a change at QB no matter how bad the starter was playing.

In baseball, if the starter is struggling, you go to the bullpen. In Hockey, if the Goalie gives up a couple of soft goals, you yank him and put in the backup. But FB coaches just seem so reluctant to make a change at QB, no matter how bad the starter is stinkin' up the joint. I've never figured that out.
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Baseball and hockey are defensive positions though. You're facing "another goal goals and we're out of it".

If a QB isn't throwing pick 6's all day, just missing a guy or something isn't quite as dramatic or decisive. They don't pull batters in offensive positions because they went 0 for 3 in the first few innings....

Also in baseball though there is a fatigue factor already built in, that kinda changes how they think about it.

In both baseball and hockey you face a lot more make or break moments.

And with a new guy .... you want to give them time to develop. It might be the wrong decision but you have to give it a shot.... you see plenty of teams try to play two QBs back and forth and it rarely works out for anyone.

It would be interesting to see someone try something like you're describing but I suspect the issue is how much time and resources they have to put into someone.
 

STPGopher said:
Mostly agree. I will say that there are times when I think it is good to pull the starter out for a series or so and point out some things. Sometimes it comes down to the starter's "make-up". Are they one that can handle being pulled? Will it motivate them? Or as has been pointed out, will it crush the QB's confidence?
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The ability or willingness to pull a starter all depends on what your backup options look like. For as frustrated as we all were with Mitch at times it always seemed there really wasn't an equal or better option waiting in the wings so they stuck with the best available option. Next year obviously we don't have the established/experienced guy in the mix so if the coaches feel guys like Croft, Rhoda, Green, Morgan are on a similar footing it would not be surprising at all to see them experiment with different guys if the starter isn't working out.
 

MNVCGUY said:
The ability or willingness to pull a starter all depends on what your backup options look like. For as frustrated as we all were with Mitch at times it always seemed there really wasn't an equal or better option waiting in the wings so they stuck with the best available option. Next year obviously we don't have the established/experienced guy in the mix so if the coaches feel guys like Croft, Rhoda, Green, Morgan are on a similar footing it would not be surprising at all to see them experiment with different guys if the starter isn't working out.
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If you're going to rotate quarterbacks -- or at least bring in a backup as a reliever on occasion -- the second guy doesn't need to be equal or better. If he were equal or better he would be the starter. He just has to be capable enough to trust him for a series or three. And a better quality might be that he's different to change things up and give the defense a different look.
 

Lakeville Goldy said:
Is that even a realistic option? I haven't seen him play at all, so I don't know what kind of build/athletic ability he has.
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If I remember correctly, there was a lot of talk about what an incredible athlete McLaurin was and he had opportunities to go to other schools and play DB. I think he narrowed it to MN and Ole Miss tho as they were giving him a chance at QB which is what he wanted to play. Hard not to feel bad for him in that context.


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Hates Monikers said:
If you're going to rotate quarterbacks -- or at least bring in a backup as a reliever on occasion -- the second guy doesn't need to be equal or better. If he were equal or better he would be the starter. He just has to be capable enough to trust him for a series or three. And a better quality might be that he's different to change things up and give the defense a different look.
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I'd add that it would be nice to sub in when we are up so that back-ups could be developed. Last year we were all praying that Mitch wouldn't get hurt. Yes because we didn't want him to get hurt, but also because most of us (fans) felt that the team had nobody else that could come in. Thankfully Rhoda proved us wrong, but can't say any of us felt confident about it except the team.
 

My take on this is that practice is one thing, but the proof of the pudding is real game condition.

Demry Croft seem to have the most potential to become the starter with is height (6' 5") and from what I hear he has accuracy at short and longer throws. His height probably affords him good field vision. He may "fit" the kind of offense that Cairrocca and Fleck want to run the best coming out of Spring practice.

Somebody needs to put some meat on this kid. He is listed at 200 lbs. Can he be durable and mobile when he has to? Can he sustain a hit and stay durable? Can he go through his progressions and make his reads quickly? Is he mobile enough and does he have quick release of the football?

Rhoda being a fifth year senior at 6'3" 215 lbs provides insurance policy. He may not be the best QB, but he is a stabilizing force. Being with the program that long has value. He has contributed over his career whether running the opponents offense during practice or being called to start on an emergency basis. He is one of the unsung heroes that you want on the team. His loyalty is being rewarded. He "earned" the privilege to be a part of this team thru hard work and dedication.

IMHO, if Rhoda gets beaten out of the starting QB battle, that is a good thing. That bodes well for the team in terms of having quality backups for when Rhoda graduates.

Green is the beefiest QB they have at 6'4" 235 lbs. I think the suspension hurt his development. You don't want to write him off because he may develop to be a good one. He needs to fight and work hard. We may need a road grader in some games. He is in good hands with the current coaching staff. It sounds like they really put a premium on player development.

Morgan it sounds like he has potential, but maybe a RS year would do him him a lot of good. He is with higher level competition now that HS. He has now until the end of Fall practice to show the coaches how quickly he develops. He did himself a favor by enrolling early.

My early prediction is Croft is the starting QB with Rhoda the backup. Third string is too early to call, but I am leaning towards Green.

We've got 2018 commit Brennan Armstrong in the wings. With PJF and Ciarrocca, we are starting to attract higher caliber QBs. What the Gopher Football team would look like three years from now is exciting.
 

Good post Hungan1.
Croft does need a little more weight, although he looks more solid and put together now than when he was a Fr or So. Are the weights listed on the roster recent or are they from last year? He was a dual threat QB coming out of HS, so I believe he will be mobile and will be able to take a hit. Biggest unknown is can he make the reads and get the ball out on time. His release is the quickest of all the QB's.

Like having Rhoda back, pushing for the starting job. If he earns it that is good and if not, then we have a veteran back up for the year while the others develop.

Green has a long way to go, but has also come a long way with his throwing motion since he first enrolled. Don't think his suspension hurt his development too much since he only missed a few practices for the bowl game and then was able to start back up when spring practice began.
 

hungan1 said:
We've got 2018 commit Brennan Armstrong in the wings. With PJF and Ciarrocca, we are starting to attract higher caliber QBs. What the Gopher Football team would look like three years from now is exciting.
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Demry was ranked higher than either Morgan or Armstrong


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GopherWeatherGuy said:
They are all very close. Armstrong is ranked the same as Croft on Rivals. Morgan and Armstrong had better offers though.
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Close?
Hasn't your battle cry been that rankings can be followed without deviation? I seem to recall you posting tables in an effort to prove that argument.


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Spoofin said:
Close?
Hasn't your battle cry been that rankings can be followed without deviation? I seem to recall you posting tables in an effort to prove that argument.
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Rankings do matter. Never said they didn't. Was just pointing out that Croft wasn't necessarily higher than Armstrong depending on the source. Even the difference on 247 is only a couple tenths.

Plus Armstrong could still be ranked higher later this year.
 

Going back to 2010, the QB's and their 247 composite, we've recruited are:
Pride .7808, Parish .8516, Shortell .8447, Leidner .8285, Nelson .8583, Streveler .8119, Roden-Mckinzy .8547, Croft .8532, Green .8813, Williams .8025, Morgan .8375, Estes .8341 and now Armstrong .8462

Other than Pride, who was only brought in to try to land Henderson, Streveler and Williams, the rest of the QB's are all really close in ranking with Green being ranked slightly higher. The development of Croft, and the rest in the program now and going forward will be the key. That was one area where Kill/Claeys struggled, they had highly recruited guys, just weren't able to develop them very much at all.

Ciarrocca can hopefully take these guys and turn them into top tier BIG QB's
 


joshvanklomp said:
From what we've heard out of spring ball, this does seem to be the case. Think they'd try to redshirt Morgan?
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I'd be surprised if they didn't.

Unless Croft and Rhoda both get hurt and they think Morgan is better than Green.
 

Isn't the word on Morgan that he is super small? Clint Brewster small?


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