Gophers reporting minor NCAA violation but ‘not recruiting Western Michigan students’

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Bob_Loblaw said:
He hasn't said anything that outrageous. He simply asked if a coach having a minor NCAA violation in his first month of work concerns anyone. How is that agenda driven?

He isn't making up the scenario that went down to fit his narrative. (see Johnnyboy)
He isn't making a red herring argument (are you saying he is going to pay players). (see Johnnyboy)

He simply asked a question about the facts that we KNOW. The U is reporting a minor recruiting violation because of PJ Fleck's contact with his former WMU players, does that concern anyone? It does imply that Fleck either didn't know about the rule or he didn't care about the rule. I don't think anyone on this board was pretending that it was a huge deal, but maybe a little concerning? For month 1 of a coaching tenure?

The real strange thing (to me) about this thread is that you have the Pioneer Press with a small story about the violation (even allowed Coyle to give our side of the story) and a poster simply ask if a violation is a concern and the board's reaction is like this? Why would the Pioneer Press report this? Because it's news. Someone obviously has an agenda for simply asking the question? D'ok.

Do people realize that you can like PJ but not agree with every single one of his actions? Like, you can say "I think the earbud rule is silly" and still support PJ. You can say "he should have called that recruit before pulling the scholarship" and still like PJ. You can say "a minor recruiting violation in month 1 bugs me" and still like PJ.
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You haven't been paying attention to enough of his posts, which is probably a good thing. Although I'm not sure how that is possible either as he repeats the same 5 things over and over every single day.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
You haven't been paying attention to enough of his posts, which is probably a good thing. Although I'm not sure how that is possible either as he repeats the same 5 things over and over every single day.
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1. My expectations are 8+ wins

2. It's a simple offense a toddler could be quarterback

3. Kill was already doing the things PJ has implemented.

4. Culture change isn't needed
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
He hasn't said anything that outrageous. He simply asked if a coach having a minor NCAA violation in his first month of work concerns anyone. How is that agenda driven?

He isn't making up the scenario that went down to fit his narrative. (see Johnnyboy)
He isn't making a red herring argument (are you saying he is going to pay players). (see Johnnyboy)

He simply asked a question about the facts that we KNOW. The U is reporting a minor recruiting violation because of PJ Fleck's contact with his former WMU players, does that concern anyone? It does imply that Fleck either didn't know about the rule or he didn't care about the rule. I don't think anyone on this board was pretending that it was a huge deal, but maybe a little concerning? For month 1 of a coaching tenure?

The real strange thing (to me) about this thread is that you have the Pioneer Press with a small story about the violation (even allowed Coyle to give our side of the story) and a poster simply ask if a violation is a concern and the board's reaction is like this? Why would the Pioneer Press report this? Because it's news. Someone obviously has an agenda for simply asking the question? D'ok.

Do people realize that you can like PJ but not agree with every single one of his actions? Like, you can say "I think the earbud rule is silly" and still support PJ. You can say "he should have called that recruit before pulling the scholarship" and still like PJ. You can say "a minor recruiting violation in month 1 bugs me" and still like PJ.
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He had multiple comments to multiple other comments all it seemed to me insinuating PJ guilty of something.... that's my take, thus my comment and I'm sticking with it. Nothing personal, I just agreed with someone other than you on this topic.
 


GopherWeatherGuy said:
You haven't been paying attention to enough of his posts, which is probably a good thing. Although I'm not sure how that is possible either as he repeats the same 5 things over and over every single day.
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That could be, I'm sure he's coming from a biased view (we all are). If he would have said something outrageous like "PJ is going put this program into NCAA sanctions", I wouldn't be defending the post.

That said, I thought his question in this thread was perfectly reasonable. I thought the outrage that someone had the audacity to ask the question was bizarre. I thought being annoyed that the Pioneer Press had an article about it was bizarre.
 


Wally said:
I am hoping he finds a way to pay players. They deserve it.
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They deserve what they agreed to and nothing more. If they are able to find a better deal elsewhere, there's the door.
 

PMWinSTP said:
I don't even know what this comment is supposed to mean. Fleck knew it would be a violation, however minor to have the contact, but he did it anyway?

What's concerning? Pretty sure a former player contacted him and he responded before he got his release. Oh well
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Innuendo. Some want to assume the worst, others the best. Sounds like it could be a pretty minor infraction, kinda like driving 58 mph in a 55 mph zone.
 

Maverick said:
He had multiple comments to multiple other comments all it seemed to me insinuating PJ guilty of something.... that's my take, thus my comment and I'm sticking with it. Nothing personal, I just agreed with someone other than you on this topic.
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The U self reported the violation...which is a fact...what did I insinuate he was guilty of?
 

Summer of 2014 Ohio state had 20+ "minor violations"


So I am revising my prediction from 7-5 to national title
 



Reminds me of James franklin a few years back. I liked his response where he basically said screw the NCAA, I'm going to talk to people I have a relationship with.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
1. My expectations are 8+ wins

2. It's a simple offense a toddler could be quarterback

3. Kill was already doing the things PJ has implemented.

4. Culture change isn't needed
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Nice summary...a little embellished on your part...no surprise there.

1. 8 wins in regular season this year. 8+ would be awesome.
2. Fleck said that, which someone else initially posted and I referred to in a response.
3. Again, another poster, swingman I think, posted the comparisons and I simply referred to those posts.
4. The broad-brush "culture change" approach/comments do an incredible disservice to the 100's of FB student athletes who did all the right things, played and studied hard, graduated, and did fantastic jobs representing the U. It's a backhand to the previous coaching staff as well.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
3. Kill was already doing the things PJ has implemented.

4. Culture change isn't needed
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except kill was no longer the coach. We dont know that claeys continued all kill's culture items.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

Let's stretch our imaginations>

Let's pretend there was a headline in the paper that said "Iowa football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

Or, how about a headline that said "Wisconsin Football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

What would the reaction on this board be?

"Nothing to worry about," OR

"The Coach is supposed to know the rules. What an idiot."

Look, in the big picture, this is a very minor violation. But, it is a violation. It's a legitimate news story. It's a very small spot on Fleck's shining image. I just find it interesting how hard some people on here try to defend Fleck.
 



short ornery norwegian said:
Let's stretch our imaginations>

Let's pretend there was a headline in the paper that said "Iowa football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

Or, how about a headline that said "Wisconsin Football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

What would the reaction on this board be?

"Nothing to worry about," OR

"The Coach is supposed to know the rules. What an idiot."

Look, in the big picture, this is a very minor violation. But, it is a violation. It's a legitimate news story. It's a very small spot on Fleck's shining image. I just find it interesting how hard some people on here try to defend Fleck.
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I'm not going to predict GH reactions.

But schools report minor rules infractions every year.... it hardly ever gets posted here even.
 

dpodoll68 said:
This rule is really stupid as applied here. If you take it to its logical extreme, a coach could be cited for shaking hands and talking to a player after a game. Is Pat Fitzgerald going to have to report a minor violation for shaking hands and saying "good game" to Mitch Leidner after we beat them last fall? I am quite certain that he didn't seek written permission from the University of Minnesota before he did that.
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Agree 100%. I mean you wish a guy you coached for how many years a Happy Birthday and that's a violation? Crazy.

I think the whole father figure analogy is probably a little overstated for most player/coach relationships, but there is DEFINITELY a strong relationship between many players and their coaches. These are people they know, trust and respect (for the most part). If a kid was thinking about transferring out of WMU (for example), I can see where he'd want to talk to a coach who was outside the program that he trusted to discuss his rationale and make sure he was making the right decision.

Honestly, why don't they just make a rule that players can't transfer to schools where their former head coach is or their former position coach without some sort of clearance from the previous school. Then contact becomes a non-issue, unless you have a very bitter coach who tries to destroy his former program, but that would be career suicide.
 

Lakeville Goldy said:
Agree 100%. I mean you wish a guy you coached for how many years a Happy Birthday and that's a violation? Crazy.

I think the whole father figure analogy is probably a little overstated for most player/coach relationships, but there is DEFINITELY a strong relationship between many players and their coaches. These are people they know, trust and respect (for the most part). If a kid was thinking about transferring out of WMU (for example), I can see where he'd want to talk to a coach who was outside the program that he trusted to discuss his rationale and make sure he was making the right decision.

Honestly, why don't they just make a rule that players can't transfer to schools where their former head coach is or their former position coach without some sort of clearance from the previous school. Then contact becomes a non-issue, unless you have a very bitter coach who tries to destroy his former program, but that would be career suicide.
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Well as it is you can't just transfer without consequences if you don't get an the ok from a school (unless you graduated)... so it isn't like it is that easy.

But really that doesn't address inappropriate contact between coaches from other schools and players.

Even the NFL has tampering rules to avoid some issues.
 

The flock oFleckers point out that one of the contacts was a birthday message but didn't say what the other contact or contacts was so it could have been recruiting, we don't really know. To me, it's not a big deal either way - I think it's a dumb rule because of the transfer rule. Why keep players from transferring from bad situations?

But, that's the rule. A rule without apparent repercussions? What's the point then?

Fleck either didn't know the rule or ignored it because it's dumb and there are no penalties. Either one slightly taints his aura in my view since he is the one talking about excelling and culture change. He should take his advice - failure is gROWing.
 

highwayman said:
Please stop quoting Pre Menstrual Woman inSTP in your responses. Quoting them allows us to still read their comments, as asinine and stupid as they are.

There's a reason they are on my blocked list. You should do it too.
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Please stop using an integral part of this forum to respond to this one user I don't like so that I don't have to see his posts in your responses to him, k thx bai. -highwayman

Couldn't you, ya know, just not read the posts that he's quoted in? Seems pretty easy to me, or can you not help yourself? Its not other user's problem, nor their job, to prevent you from reading something you don't want to.


On another note, does anyone know that this minor violation is related to football in any way?
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Let's stretch our imaginations>

Let's pretend there was a headline in the paper that said "Iowa football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

Or, how about a headline that said "Wisconsin Football coach committed minor NCAA rules violation."

What would the reaction on this board be?

"Nothing to worry about," OR

"The Coach is supposed to know the rules. What an idiot."

Look, in the big picture, this is a very minor violation. But, it is a violation. It's a legitimate news story. It's a very small spot on Fleck's shining image. I just find it interesting how hard some people on here try to defend Fleck.
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Or how some people on here like yourself try to discredit Fleck at every turn. All part of your wait and see approach before passing judgment on a coach you have said multiple times isn't your cup of tea.
 

I always wondered if Brewster ever self reported any NCAA violations for cooking his Chili too hot for players. You know how dangerous that is?! Won't someone think of the players?!
 


Halsey Hall said:
[/B]


I just find it interesting how hard some people on here try to find fault with Fleck
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But didn't PJF do something wrong here. Twice?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

PMWinSTP said:
I agree he's a tool for a reporter, but nobody has any concern it has happened in Fleck's first couple months, however minor it seems?
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Self-reported. Could have been a mistake so it's better to get it out there.
The cover up is always worse than the crime.
 

PMWinSTP said:
I don't even know what this comment is supposed to mean. Fleck knew it would be a violation, however minor to have the contact, but he did it anyway?
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FIRE HIM NOW!!!
 


A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Well as it is you can't just transfer without consequences if you don't get an the ok from a school (unless you graduated)... so it isn't like it is that easy.

But really that doesn't address inappropriate contact between coaches from other schools and players.

Even the NFL has tampering rules to avoid some issues.
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The NFL takes fear of tampering to the height of absurdity. This raises an important question: why is tampering destructive to the NFL or NCAA member schools? In the NFL it seems to be a purely economic issue. Allowing players to freely entertain offers and negotiate throughout the year would likely lead to more offers, wider negotiations, and higher salaries. That's bad news for the owners.

In the NCAA I can't think of a good reason. The players already have to sit for a year which is an enormous deterrent. If the odd player is motivated enough to leave a school and seeks release despite this enormous deterrent I can't see the economic harm to the institution. Shouldn't a player have the ability to shop themselves? Why the pedantic rules in a league without salaries and a huge economic hit to the player if he chooses to transfer (likely loss of a year of earning ability)?

Someone needs to spell out why wishing someone happy birthday is harmful to either Spillane or WMU. Why is Spillane leaving WMU a bad thing if he can seek better opportunities elsewhere.

What if the same rules applied to you when seeking new employment? No ability to find a new job before quitting? Good for you? Or good for the company?
 

Pompous Elitist said:
The NFL takes fear of tampering to the height of absurdity. This raises an important question: why is tampering destructive to the NFL or NCAA member schools? In the NFL it seems to be a purely economic issue. Allowing players to freely entertain offers and negotiate throughout the year would likely lead to more offers, wider negotiations, and higher salaries. That's bad news for the owners.

In the NCAA I can't think of a good reason. The players already have to sit for a year which is an enormous deterrent. If the odd player is motivated enough to leave a school and seeks release despite this enormous deterrent I can't see the economic harm to the institution. Shouldn't a player have the ability to shop themselves? Why the pedantic rules in a league without salaries and a huge economic hit to the player if he chooses to transfer (likely loss of a year of earning ability)?

Someone needs to spell out for why wishing someone happy birthday is harmful to either Spillane or WMU. Why is Spillane leaving WMU a bad thing if he can seek better opportunities elsewhere.

What if the same rules applied to you when seeking new employment? No ability to find a new job before quitting? Good for you? Or good for the company?
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The NCAA is crazy, but I could see teams encouraging players on opposing teams to transfer to them... and man don't have too good a game against us ahahahahahah... no really...

Anyway you can shop yourself in the NCAA... just only AFTER you're actually released.
 

Yeah but what starting player is going to do that? It happens but it isn't a very common thing. Usually starter quality players stay where they are or they transfer as graduates. If they aren't starting at a school and want to transfer to a better opportunity (think QBs) I see no reason to discourage that other than a coach wants to selfishly keep them just in case. I again ask you to think about these types of rules for everyday Americans. It seems absurd, no?
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Yeah but what starting player is going to do that? It happens but it isn't a very common thing. Usually starter quality players stay where they are or they transfer as graduates. If they aren't starting at a school and want to transfer to a better opportunity (think QBs) I see no reason to discourage that other than a coach wants to selfishly keep them just in case. I again ask you to think about these types of rules for everyday Americans. It seems absurd, no?
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Out of context everything seems absurd...
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Yeah but what starting player is going to do that? It happens but it isn't a very common thing. Usually starter quality players stay where they are or they transfer as graduates. If they aren't starting at a school and want to transfer to a better opportunity (think QBs) I see no reason to discourage that other than a coach wants to selfishly keep them just in case. I again ask you to think about these types of rules for everyday Americans. It seems absurd, no?
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Shannon Brooks was injured early last season and his carries were down quite a bit from the previous year. What if Wisconsin started talking to him mid year last year or even at the end of the year and wanted him to transfer to be their feature back in two years. Would we all be ok with that contact from Wisc?
 

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