STrib: Black coaches vanish from Big Ten, once a model for diversity in college hoops

I will post the facts and the outrage meter will be off the charts.

1. Asians have higher IQ's than whites.

2. Whites have higher IQ's than blacks.

This is why it's a mystery to everyone about race. No one can ever tell the truth. Whites have higher IQ's overall. That's it. You can find study after study after study on this. You can also use your own eyes.

Now go crazy. By the way, I was racist to myself because I said asians have higher IQ's than my own, so save the crying.

Lol. Nice troll job. Especially like the juvenile 'I was racist to myself' statement. If you were as educated in this subject as you think you are, you'd also point out that numerous studies (available for free on the Google machine) note that IQ is legitimately affected by socio economic environments to the point where children from poor homes raised their IQs significantly upon being sent to wealthier homes. Guess what? On average blacks are far poorer than whites. Think that affects IQ scores? Get smart homie
 

So lets see here, 2 of the last 4 coaches the U of M has hired were black coaches, and we tried to hire another one but he turned us down, so we hired a white coach and while he wasn't doing well, no one says anything, but only after he starts to succeed, the STAR TRIBUNE of all papers, feels it necessary to bring up this question?

Doesn't surprise me one bit.

Yea, Marcus, the guy that just spent 15 MNS on his latest podcast arguing why Pitino should be COY is out to get him by writing an article about the entire conference
 

This article is trying to make an issue out of nothing.

If you believe that Big 10 ADs are discriminating against head coaching candidates, you believe that they intentionally skip over the best person for the job. While I'm sure it happens, do you really think it is common for ADs to make decisions that will hurt their athletic departments because of race?

Here are some more reasonable explanations other than racism:
- People are influenced by their parents. It wasn't that long ago that there were significant barriers to black people coaching. Many white people who are now at coaching age grew up with their dad as a basketball coach and were influenced with them. Not as many black people had the same experience.
- On average, black people are better at basketball and much more likely to make the NBA. White people are more likely to fall short of the NBA and start coaching instead.
- Black coaches on average prefer different types of coaching jobs and have less desire to be a Big 10 coach. For example, preferring to coach for a team at the top of a worse conference than a team near the bottom of the Big 10.
- 12% of Americans are black which translates to 1-2 Big 10 coaches with a lot of variance. With that small of a sample size, 0 black coaches isn't unreasonable.

Funny how no one ever complains that there are too many black head coaches in the NBA. The number of black coaches there is disproportionately high, to nearly the same extent as 0 black Big 10 head coaches is disproportionately low.

If a school passes up a black coach who is interested and is clearly the best for the job, then start complaining. Equal opportunity, not equal results.
 

While I'm sure it happens, do you really think it is common for ADs to make decisions that will hurt their athletic departments because of race?

No. I don't see many people arguing there is a some racist conspiracy at play.

I would imagine the overwhelming majority of ADs in the country hire the person they think is the best candidate for the job. No racism at play. No ulterior motive.

The issue at play (which is at least worth discussing as a society) is that there is no definition of "best candidate" for a coaching position. Part of it is resume, but many cases it's not (e.g. Pitino). When "feel or fit" is a big part of it, the decision can be influenced on cultural fit, ability to relate to the candidate, shared life experiences, subconscious stereotypes, etc.

It's at least worth discussing as a society. I think those who immediately say "nothing to see here" are missing the point.
 

That comparison is not at all accurate. First the NFL is over 70% black which is why the lack of black HCs was alarming. There are almost 0 Hispanics or Asians which is why there's no need to question the lack of HCs of those races. And it's also a terrible comparison to talk about the lack of white players in the NBA and NFL as if they lack opportunities or have been historically denied them by the white people in charge. There are far more white HS FB and BB players than black yet the numbers in D1 sports and the NBA/NFL shift. That's merit based, not opportunity based.

Good points and I thought it was a well written and timely piece. I did think the photos used for the hard copy were funny.

Totally unrelated, but would it hurt for Kfan or Kstp to hire some black hosts for their radio shows. Give me Henry Lake over Chris Hawky any day.
 


No. I don't see many people arguing there is a some racist conspiracy at play.

I would imagine the overwhelming majority of ADs in the country hire the person they think is the best candidate for the job. No racism at play. No ulterior motive.

The issue at play (which is at least worth discussing as a society) is that there is no definition of "best candidate" for a coaching position. Part of it is resume, but many cases it's not (e.g. Pitino). When "feel or fit" is a big part of it, the decision can be influenced on cultural fit, ability to relate to the candidate, shared life experiences, subconscious stereotypes, etc.

It's at least worth discussing as a society. I think those who immediately say "nothing to see here" are missing the point.

Considering how many black players there are in college basketball, if anything, a black coach would fit better as they'd have more shared experiences with the team.

There may be something to see here, but there aren't enough data points by just looking at the Big 10. If you look at all of D1, 22% of coaches are black, much higher than 12% of Americans overall. The number of black coaches is actually disproportionately high. For every conference like the Big 10, there's one with many black coaches.

Of course that doesn't take into account all of the other factors in play. But to look at the NCAA D1 coaches and say there's a problem of black coaches being underrepresented has no backing. At least the NCAA doesn't have a rule requiring teams to racially discriminate in hiring like the NFL.
 

No. I don't see many people arguing there is a some racist conspiracy at play.

I would imagine the overwhelming majority of ADs in the country hire the person they think is the best candidate for the job. No racism at play. No ulterior motive.

The issue at play (which is at least worth discussing as a society) is that there is no definition of "best candidate" for a coaching position. Part of it is resume, but many cases it's not (e.g. Pitino). When "feel or fit" is a big part of it, the decision can be influenced on cultural fit, ability to relate to the candidate, shared life experiences, subconscious stereotypes, etc.

It's at least worth discussing as a society. I think those who immediately say "nothing to see here" are missing the point.

I agree with this. There's probably people on both sides of these discussions that are a little extreme. Those that just automatically assume there is nothing going on and those that automatically assume the Big Ten is racist because there are no black coaches right now.

While I don't think there are too many people who just flat out say or even think "I'm not going to hire a black coach", there are probably some who subconsciously look at the accomplishments of black and white candidates differently.
 

Considering how many black players there are in college basketball, if anything, a black coach would fit better as they'd have more shared experiences with the team.

There may be something to see here, but there aren't enough data points by just looking at the Big 10. If you look at all of D1, 22% of coaches are black, much higher than 12% of Americans overall. The number of black coaches is actually disproportionately high. For every conference like the Big 10, there's one with many black coaches.

Of course that doesn't take into account all of the other factors in play. But to look at the NCAA D1 coaches and say there's a problem of black coaches being underrepresented has no backing. At least the NCAA doesn't have a rule requiring teams to racially discriminate in hiring like the NFL.

Shared experiences with the hiring AD and the admin (mostly white guys), not the players. A.k.a the interview process.
 

I agree with this. There's probably people on both sides of these discussions that are a little extreme. Those that just automatically assume there is nothing going on and those that automatically assume the Big Ten is racist because there are no black coaches right now.

While I don't think there are too many people who just flat out say or even think "I'm not going to hire a black coach", there are probably some who subconsciously look at the accomplishments of black and white candidates differently.

Agree
 



I agree with this. There's probably people on both sides of these discussions that are a little extreme. Those that just automatically assume there is nothing going on and those that automatically assume the Big Ten is racist because there are no black coaches right now.

While I don't think there are too many people who just flat out say or even think "I'm not going to hire a black coach", there are probably some who subconsciously look at the accomplishments of black and white candidates differently.
I've yet to see anyone claim any person or organization is overtly racist regarding this issue.
 

I've yet to see anyone claim any person or organization is overtly racist regarding this issue.

I appreciate your attempts at reasonable discourse. Problem is some of the most vehement people arguing with you don't understand institutional racism and what sort of a factor it plays. Game after game you see 9 or 10 blacks players on the floor and yet not one black head coach? Lot more complicated than claiming AD's are or are not racist.
 

I appreciate your attempts at reasonable discourse. Problem is some of the most vehement people arguing with you don't understand institutional racism and what sort of a factor it plays. Game after game you see 9 or 10 blacks players on the floor and yet not one black head coach? Lot more complicated than claiming AD's are or are not racist.

That's true. Though I suspect for many its not simply not understanding institutional racism, its being unwilling to even attempt to understand it. Which I actually get. About a year ago I had a series of discussions with a white friend/mentor of mine regarding race as he was, by his admission, just beginning to really understand race relations and racial history in America. He leads a small group of men once a week and had a desire to begin talking about these things as his group is all white, 30-60 or so aged guys. What he told me has stuck with me. He said (paraphrasing) 'The issue a lot of us white guys have is that really understanding this race issue means we have to change the entire way we view our world and America and a lot of us just aren't willing to do that'. Of course I summed it up there but that's what I see ALL the time in these types of discussions. People being seemingly willfully ignorant to or utterly dismissive of things that are actually proven, researched truths.
 

That's true. Though I suspect for many its not simply not understanding institutional racism, its being unwilling to even attempt to understand it. Which I actually get. About a year ago I had a series of discussions with a white friend/mentor of mine regarding race as he was, by his admission, just beginning to really understand race relations and racial history in America. He leads a small group of men once a week and had a desire to begin talking about these things as his group is all white, 30-60 or so aged guys. What he told me has stuck with me. He said (paraphrasing) 'The issue a lot of us white guys have is that really understanding this race issue means we have to change the entire way we view our world and America and a lot of us just aren't willing to do that'. Of course I summed it up there but that's what I see ALL the time in these types of discussions. People being seemingly willfully ignorant to or utterly dismissive of things that are actually proven, researched truths.

Bingo. This is the essence of confirmation bias.
It's hard to think your world view may be wrong.
 



Bingo. This is the essence of confirmation bias.
It's hard to think your world view may be wrong.

Yep. And while it may be especially true for those among the majority communities, its necessary for everyone to do, myself included.
 

That's true. Though I suspect for many its not simply not understanding institutional racism, its being unwilling to even attempt to understand it. Which I actually get. About a year ago I had a series of discussions with a white friend/mentor of mine regarding race as he was, by his admission, just beginning to really understand race relations and racial history in America. He leads a small group of men once a week and had a desire to begin talking about these things as his group is all white, 30-60 or so aged guys. What he told me has stuck with me. He said (paraphrasing) 'The issue a lot of us white guys have is that really understanding this race issue means we have to change the entire way we view our world and America and a lot of us just aren't willing to do that'. Of course I summed it up there but that's what I see ALL the time in these types of discussions. People being seemingly willfully ignorant to or utterly dismissive of things that are actually proven, researched truths.

Absolutely. It's beneficial to remember that the foundation of this country was built on the backs of slaves. That's not a political statement, that's concrete fact. Meanwhile, there was ethnic cleansing running rampant in those early days. I bring this up because as much as we'd all like to think that 250 years is a long time, it's really not. Most of us have biases that we'll never truly understand or acknowledge before the day we die.

Ultimately, these issues are socioeconomic as oleboy mentioned in a previous post. If you haven't spent time in government housing communities you should. Or just low-income housing districts. This is a matter of access to education. And please remember that access to education is completely separate from access to a classroom. Education is more so what happens in your household and in your community. Much of the time, priorities for those living in low income housing, are vastly different from those living in medium to high income housing. There are so many negative social factors that people who grew up in middle class neighborhoods can never fully understand.

Just because someone grows up in low income areas, it doesn't preclude them from future success in industry, or coaching for that matter. But what it does is present a much longer series of hurdles that the individual has to overcome. In my life, I've had very few hurdles and unsurprisingly I have good wages and access to healthcare and everything I need in my life. As an example, I work with a very poor minority boy, whose line of hurdles is much much longer than mine ever was, and I honestly doubt that he'll ever find himself in a position as cushy as mine.

It's okay to be white and middle class, and to not feel guilty about it. However, it's unacceptable to sweep these systemic issues under the rug, and to do nothing about it. Like the STRIB, I have no answers, but I do believe that this overall issue is the most pressing thing that we have to deal with as a society, and I think that any conversation about it is not only merited, but necessary.
 

snowflakes hating on the reality. Blacks are poor because 70% of the fathers have no interest in raising their kids. Not graduating and having babies before having a job is why they're poor. Has nothing to do with white people and everything relating to the current culture.
 

snowflakes hating on the reality. Blacks are poor because 70% of the fathers have no interest in raising their kids. Not graduating and having babies before having a job is why they're poor. Has nothing to do with white people and everything relating to the current culture.

The question is cultural. What factors have led to black fathers not being present in their child's life? Your statement could be read as though it's a genetic factor, which would be completely false and thoughtless.
 

The question is cultural. What factors have led to black fathers not being present in their child's life? Your statement could be read as though it's a genetic factor, which would be completely false and thoughtless.

"genetic factor" Are you effing serious?? What's lead to this? The culture. The culture of making fun of blacks doing well in school. Treating women like hoes. Not giving a damn about their children. dOING NOTHING. Not caring. Honoring disrespect. And...white liberals. Those are the causes.
 

The question is cultural. What factors have led to black fathers not being present in their child's life? Your statement could be read as though it's a genetic factor, which would be completely false and thoughtless.

It's not genetic. The problem is largely cultural, the best example of this is the pejorative term that is used 'act white' which tells you all you need to know about the prevalent destructive culture that has developed. I could care less the term is a negative and makes reference to white people as whole, frankly if people want to hate me because I'm white well so be it. The part that upsets me is that the term is considered a slam, and you know what the term means, it means succeeding in education amongst other things! So you have a strong element, an influential element, in the culture that glorifies ignorance, where is this element coming from? How can any group of people succeed when their youth are being poisoned with this mind set?


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"genetic factor" Are you effing serious?? What's lead to this? The culture. The culture of making fun of blacks doing well in school. Treating women like hoes. Not giving a damn about their children. dOING NOTHING. Not caring. Honoring disrespect. And...white liberals. Those are the causes.

LOL. I love how you completely disregard the historical elements that have led us to today's "black" culture. You don't want to think about it any deeper than your honky tonk brain allows, so we'll leave it at that.
 

LOL. I love how you completely disregard the historical elements that have led us to today's "black" culture. You don't want to think about it any deeper than your honky tonk brain allows, so we'll leave it at that.

"Honky tonk brain", who can argue with that, well done


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"Honky tonk brain", who can argue with that, well done


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Who can argue with nasa's thought provoking take on white liberal's playing a significant role in today's problematic black culture? I like how you ignored that one and chose to comment on mine. Cool.

I only replied to his ignorant post in the first place because it's classic black community blaming and shaming. People don't like to address the historical issues that have led us to where we are today. Last time I checked it was about 50 years ago that segregation was practiced. I wonder if black hatred and undermining is pervasive from just 50 years ago? Hmm...

Maybe, if people stopped playing the blame game, we could actually take steps to improve our communities. White liberals.... LOL. Thanks
 

If you look at it from an opportunistic standpoint the entry level positions to get into coaching (assistant coaching/low level head coaching) aren't great paying jobs and can be vanity projects for people who have the outside means to support themselves until they can break through to a job that pays the bills. That does put people who are economically worse off in a bad position and if it's being offered as a given that blacks are statistically poorer then it seems reasonable that has something to do with the disparity. Also seems that looking at the bulk of assistant coaches most never played professionally, which makes sense who wants a volunteer or low paying coaching job when you can get paid to play in the NBA or overseas. It takes time to break through to being a head coach and most assistants start young, players that spend 5-10 years playing may be past the prime window to become assitants.

Look at Matt Painter and Cuonzo Martin (players from same Purdue team and both Head coaches at good schools) Matt was driving a forklift on the side when he started assistant coaching right after school. Cuonzo possibly never becomes a coach if his playing days weren't cut short by injury. Matt got to a top spot quicker because in part he was assistant coaching right away while Cuonzo was still playing. With a narrow lens you could look at this and claim Purdue hired the white guy over the black guy but with a wider lens you see Gene Keady produced two quality coaches one of which was ready to take over when he retired and the other was just getting started and didn't have the resume for the job yet, but got to a similar position eventually.
 

Blame it on the social engineers in the deep state; single parent black households immediately post WW2 were less than 10%. It has been one big social engineering experiment for TPTB over the past 50+ years which is criminal
 

Blame it on the social engineers in the deep state; single parent black households immediately post WW2 were less than 10%. It has been one big social engineering experiment for TPTB over the past 50+ years which is criminal

Truth. Ghettos aren't an accident.
 

snowflakes hating on the reality. Blacks are poor because 70% of the fathers have no interest in raising their kids. Not graduating and having babies before having a job is why they're poor. Has nothing to do with white people and everything relating to the current culture.
lol. So why were black folks poor in the 20's and 30's when the majority of homes were 2 parents? And when wealth is statistically proven to be strongly correlated to family history you are somehow blaming current culture (one in which more black people are attending college and advancing economically than any era in history). Yea, you're a racist. But you know that already. Just stop posting before you prove yourself to also be an uninformed one as well
 

It's not genetic. The problem is largely cultural, the best example of this is the pejorative term that is used 'act white' which tells you all you need to know about the prevalent destructive culture that has developed. I could care less the term is a negative and makes reference to white people as whole, frankly if people want to hate me because I'm white well so be it. The part that upsets me is that the term is considered a slam, and you know what the term means, it means succeeding in education amongst other things! So you have a strong element, an influential element, in the culture that glorifies ignorance, where is this element coming from? How can any group of people succeed when their youth are being poisoned with this mind set?


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Yea that's not at all correct. The term 'act white' A - isn't near as prevalent as many like to make it seem (just like the narrative of being made fun of for succeeding in school as if that doesn't also happen among white kids and it also ignores the reality that those who are succesful in school are OFTEN praised widely and provided tons of support amongst the black community. I was an honor student my entire life and was never, not once, clowned for being a good student) and B - isn't a negative because it represents success, its a negative because it presumes a level of fakeness and a disassociation with ones cultural identity which has historical significance as many black people have at times attempted to either 'pass' or to turn their backs on their race to be accpeted by white society because black has always been presented as bad, wrong, criminal and negative. To 'act white' is to reject the black community. So please stop with the attempts at psychoanalyzing the black community when your examples are shallow, uninformed, lazy and yea, racist.
 


Yea that's not at all correct. The term 'act white' A - isn't near as prevalent as many like to make it seem (just like the narrative of being made fun of for succeeding in school as if that doesn't also happen among white kids and it also ignores the reality that those who are succesful in school are OFTEN praised widely and provided tons of support amongst the black community. I was an honor student my entire life and was never, not once, clowned for being a good student) and B - isn't a negative because it represents success, its a negative because it presumes a level of fakeness and a disassociation with ones cultural identity which has historical significance as many black people have at times attempted to either 'pass' or to turn their backs on their race to be accpeted by white society because black has always been presented as bad, wrong, criminal and negative. To 'act white' is to reject the black community. So please stop with the attempts at psychoanalyzing the black community when your examples are shallow, uninformed, lazy and yea, racist.

Ahhh, so blacks all have to think alike, because they are black, and if they don't then they will be shamed. Ok so I got it blacks should not want to be 'accepted in white society' and whites should not want to be accepted in black society. Is an example of such fakeness like cross racial relationships? If a black woman were to date a white man would she be turning her back on her race?
 





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