Can someone outline reasons to explain the Big Ten isn't down this year?

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37score

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I'm typing this as Michigan is disposing of, Big Ten favorite to advance in the tourney, Purdue.

So are we all just average to slightly above average teams, or is there some other tail we can tell where we beat up on each other (but other conferences don't) that just make us seem to be down this year?
 

37score said:
I'm typing this as Michigan is disposing of, Big Ten favorite to advance in the tourney, Purdue.

So are we all just average to slightly above average teams, or is there some other tail we can tell where we beat up on each other (but other conferences don't) that just make us seem to be down this year?
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I don't think we have as formidable top end teams this year, but it feels like big ten has more above average squads.
 

atsgopher said:
I don't think we have as formidable top end teams this year, but it feels like big ten has more above average squads.
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The B1G clearly has no elite teams this year; but this is as deep as I've seen the conference top to bottom in decades, possibly ever. Fathom the thought that Indiana, who went 10-3 in non-conf. slate, is currently sitting at 13th place (of 14). The only bad team in the conference is Rutgers.
 

cncmin said:
The B1G clearly has no elite teams this year; but this is as deep as I've seen the conference top to bottom in decades, possibly ever. Fathom the thought that Indiana, who went 10-3 in non-conf. slate, is currently sitting at 13th place (of 14). The only bad team in the conference is Rutgers.
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If Nebraska isn't bad, they are close.
 

BEFORE Michigan beat Purdue, they were rated 27th in both the Sagarin and Ken-Pom ratings.

Indiana, above 100 in the rpi, is down at #41 in the Sagarin I believe and in the 50s in the Ken-Pom.

Same thing for other teams like Ohio St, just not as drastic of a difference.


rpi just hasn't been kind to B1G teams this year, except for our Gophers, of course.


Didn't help that Indiana, the team with the best ooc wins BY FAR, ended up going in the tank. Instead of making the B1G look better because the rest of the conference beat the team that beat UNC and Kansas, it just made those two wins look like a flukes.
 


Winasota Gopher said:
If Nebraska isn't bad, they are close.
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Nebraska had same record as penn state and won a couple of games against the top of the league - one reason to think its down is the head scratching losses several big ten teams had in the non conference schedule
 

It's tempting to see how this season has gone in the Big Ten, and think about what could've been if the PSU, MSU, and Wisconsin games had gone a little differently. But I'm on a high right now, just happy about where we are.
 

Thymanst said:
Nebraska had same record as penn state and won a couple of games against the top of the league - one reason to think its down is the head scratching losses several big ten teams had in the non conference schedule
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Eye test
 

Thymanst said:
Nebraska had same record as penn state and won a couple of games against the top of the league - one reason to think its down is the head scratching losses several big ten teams had in the non conference schedule
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Turns out that Nebraska fans are very down on Miles. I was surprised to hear this. They aren't very likely to get a better coach, IMO. Nebraska has some talent and are far from great, but also far from bad. I will be very happy if the Gophers hang +15 on them next game out.
 



jmag21 said:
It's tempting to see how this season has gone in the Big Ten, and think about what could've been if the PSU, MSU, and Wisconsin games had gone a little differently. But I'm on a high right now, just happy about where we are.
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The thing is, it was that way, but isn't anymore, especially not this 7-game streak. The Gophers have, somehow, turned around the terrible record over the past ... decade or more ... in close games and have come out on top in over half of the OT games and are 8-4, total, in very close games this year. Thus, one could argue that, for an exciting change, the Gophers' record exceeds their performance, if only very slightly.

I get what you're saying about the other lost opportunities, however, particularly since they had big leads in at least several of them. They could just as easily be a ~2 or 3 loss team as a 10+ loss team, though.
 

Conferences are judged on the number of teams that can advance to the second weekend in the NCAA tournament, IMO. And on whether or not your conference can make the Final 4. We have no Final 4 teams and we are setting ourselves up to be pounded in the first 2 rounds of the NCAA tournament. IMO, that's why people are down on the conference.
 

When was the last time we were a dead-solid lock for the NCAA tournament with 2 games remaining in the regular season schedule? Where were we at during the Vincent Grier year we were so good? Not sure. Prior to that, it had to be 1997?
 

GopherJake said:
When was the last time we were a dead-solid lock for the NCAA tournament with 2 games remaining in the regular season schedule? Where were we at during the Vincent Grier year we were so good? Not sure. Prior to that, it had to be 1997?
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04-05 w/Grier as a junior 10-3 and 11-7 and the same 10-6 at this same time that year. Lost first tourney game to No. 9 N Iowa 64 -53. The next year and Grier's last we lost 15 games. I remember how special Grier was but I don't remember losing 15 games with him.
 



macgopher said:
04-05 w/Grier as a junior 10-3 and 11-7 and the same 10-6 at this same time that year. Lost first tourney game to No. 9 N Iowa 64 -53. The next year and Grier's last we lost 15 games. I remember how special Grier was but I don't remember losing 15 games with him.
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Thanks for the details, Mac. I sort of thought we were comfortably in that year. VG single-handedly extended the Monson tenure with his play his junior year.
 

mnsportsgeek said:
Conferences are judged on the number of teams that can advance to the second weekend in the NCAA tournament, IMO. And on whether or not your conference can make the Final 4. We have no Final 4 teams and we are setting ourselves up to be pounded in the first 2 rounds of the NCAA tournament. IMO, that's why people are down on the conference.
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Not with that attitude!!
 

I think we're down because of the top of the league not being as good. But the top 7 teams could all get hot and beat any team outside of the top 8 or so teams in the country on any day. If I were a #1 seed I wouldn't want to play Purdue in the sweet 16. As a 2 seed I wouldn't want to have to play Michigan State in the 2nd round. Say we are a 6 seed would Florida state really want to play us(on neutral court) in the 2nd round?
 

It's a down year for sure but their is alot of good young talent in the league right now.
 

Indiana loses just one player, right? Minnesota loses just one! Iowa has 4 freshman starting for them? What are the other teams in the conference like?
 

KillmeNow said:
Indiana loses just one player, right? Minnesota loses just one! Iowa has 4 freshman starting for them? What are the other teams in the conference like?
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PSU is very young. Iowa is young but Jok is out, right? Maryland starts 3 freshmen, I believe. Wisconsin seems like the only one that really relies on seniors. Though I doubt Swanigan stays at Purdue for another year.
 

The Big Ten is down. So is the ACC and SEC. PAC 12 is way up. BIG 12 is very top heavy, but overall I'd say down. If the Zags want to make a big statement, this is the year to do it.
 

It seems as if any year where the perennial powers are down, it hurts the conference.

If Indiana, somehow, had turned out to be a 13-5 conference team or something, the rest of the conference would probably look better because they'd be bouncing around #5-8
Instead, we've been looking to WI, Maryland, and Purdue to be those teams and they've fallen down as well to other good teams who for a long time have been viewed as weak. Such as MN, Northwestern, and Penn St.
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
The Big Ten is down. So is the ACC and SEC. PAC 12 is way up. BIG 12 is very top heavy, but overall I'd say down. If the Zags want to make a big statement, this is the year to do it.
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Pac-12 is not WAY up, its simply VERY top heavy. Look at how incredibly bad that confernence's bottom 5 teams are. USC is what, the 4th highest rated team in the conference? Yet they are only 2-6 vs Top 50 ranked teams. UCLA is only 4-3. Zona is 6-3 and Oreg is 6-2, but Oregon has a BAD loss, meaning a loss to a team ranked higher than #100 in the rpi, and those 6 Top 50 wins, only 2 were played away from home. Compare that to Minnesota, for example, Minnesota is 6-5 with only 2 of those 6 wins being at home. 3 road wins and 1 win at a neutral court. And that will be 7 Top 50 wins come tomorrow when Michigan at #52 moves up after beating Purdue.
 

I think it happens with polling where there are these teams that dominate their conference, so they keep moving up. PAC12 is that this year where there are three good teams and the rest is not very good.
 

KillmeNow said:
Pac-12 is not WAY up, its simply VERY top heavy. Look at how incredibly bad that confernence's bottom 5 teams are. USC is what, the 4th highest rated team in the conference? Yet they are only 2-6 vs Top 50 ranked teams. UCLA is only 4-3. Zona is 6-3 and Oreg is 6-2, but Oregon has a BAD loss, meaning a loss to a team ranked higher than #100 in the rpi, and those 6 Top 50 wins, only 2 were played away from home. Compare that to Minnesota, for example, Minnesota is 6-5 with only 2 of those 6 wins being at home. 3 road wins and 1 win at a neutral court. And that will be 7 Top 50 wins come tomorrow when Michigan at #52 moves up after beating Purdue.
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You're right. I inflated the entire conference based on 3 highly ranked teams.
 

Maybe we can go with this theory.


The Big Ten is down, but very young and the teams are all better late in the year than they were early by large margins.
MSU which started off with what was a very difficult start and a fluke loss to Northeastern, are actually an excellent team.

Losses against #7,8, and #9 were all tough teams early, and their one bad loss moved them out of the rankings.
A few tough big ten losses while they are injured lowered them and they are actually very good.

Or something like that.

It would also explain much of the Gophers being down to this point because of their two early losses to MSU which at the time both looked bad.
 

We had 7 teams in last year, we had 7 the year before. We will have 7 teams in this year(or all those sports reporters will be unhappy, sorry northwestern). As a conference we are not down. We just don't have an obvious final four contender and so we are considered down.
 

Big Ten is not down this year. It's the most competitive league between the power conferences and brings the drama.

As far as talent goes, is it a top 3 conference? Who cares? Probably not. I don't know. There's something about watching teams develop talent vs schools in other conferences that just care about blue chippers that fluctuate their school's consistency/drive fan bases nuts.

Big Ten Network is arguably the most entertaining channel my cable service offers and I generally don't watch games outsides of Gopher games...this year is different.

I'm a big fan of Crispin and find Pardo, Morris and others more entertaining than their heavy hitting competitors. BTN is doing all the right things for a deserving conference in both hoops and football.
 

Looking at several different metrics or rankings I find this

Purdue and Wisconsin are the only two teams in every Top 25 cept the rpi. Meaning the Sag, Ken-Pom, Massey Ratings, TeamRankings & BPI.

Seven teams are rated in the Top 50 of EVERY matrix, with an 8th team, Indiana, ranking Top 50 in all but 2, the rpi and Massey Ratings.

Illinois is also rated #51 in the Massey ratings, and OSU is #54 on TeamRankings

13 teams are rated in the Top 100 of every matrix with the exception of the BPI that has Nebraska at #105


And 37score, your theory is a sound one. Good job. So this might be a good season to bet on B1G Conf teams to pull a couple upsets, but is probably not a season to hope for a team in the Final Four.
 

KillmeNow said:
Indiana loses just one player, right? Minnesota loses just one! Iowa has 4 freshman starting for them? What are the other teams in the conference like?
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Indiana will lose OG and Bryant to the draft. Possibly Blackman, there lone senior Hartman will probably get a Medical waiver, but who knows if he will come back to IU
 

Hmm, It's tough to say it isn't down. It is.

But, as others have pointed out, We aren't too far off from being very good as a conference.

Say for instance the Gophers had won against MSU, @PSU, Maryland and against WIS. They would be 14-2 an 26-3, ranked in the top 10 for certain. But this is not the case for any B1G team so the outlook of the conference to everyone is they are down. Plus, we lost the ACC/B1G challenge and the ACC is considered down.

So we look worse to all.

I tell you what though, ask how many coaches are going to want to face Michigan, Michigan State or the Gophers right now. All three of these teams are peaking!
 

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