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  1. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigticket1 View Post
    So you know that Fleck did not consult with his AD before booting the players ? Or someone higher in the food chain ?
    “Having heard this news early this morning, I took action to immediately suspend both freshman players indefinitely. We expect to learn more about these allegations today. I'm extremely disappointed and want to assure the community that this kind of conduct is unacceptable and does not represent the values of this team or this university.

    http://www.freep.com/story/sports/co...ball/89489270/

    So in less than 24 hours after the incident, they were off the team. Doesn't sound like someone who waited around for higher-ups to tell him what to do.
    Last edited by joshvanklomp; 02-17-2017 at 06:56 AM.


  2. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winnipegopher View Post

    Yes, completely agree.
    I'm not too sure whether I agree with this whole thread or not.... could be just a good point/counterpoint discussion..... not arguementative...

  3. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Slab_of_Bacon View Post
    I don't want to get into this whole thing but I don't think the existence of a January hearing really addresses the ideas behind the boycott.

    They could have been all reinstated by a coin flip... it still wouldn't have addressed the point.
    Very true. Concerns about due process for students trying to defend themselves against Code violations is not new, just new to some posters here...I've posted many times, with the link, that the Chair of the BoR has expressed publicly he's had concerns and talked multiple times with Kaler about those concerns. That's just here at the U...it's been a concern nationally for some time.

  4. #79
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    Back to the article & the anonymous player.....I think if you put the pieces together, you can come up with an educated guess on who it may be.

    I do agree with him that there were probably a few in addition to himself that may not have totally been on board with the boycott, but were afraid to say anything as it would look like they're not supporting their teammates. Peer pressure at it's very highest. I have always maintained that I think the biggest mistake the players made was an "all 10 suspensions reversed or else" ultimatum.

    I do think that the boycott was a success in terms of the attention it brought to the process. They may have had a hearing in planned hearing in January, but I think it would have gone a lot more under the radar. I think it definitely made the U more aware that it was going to be watched in terms of fairness.

  5. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by joshvanklomp View Post
    “Having heard this news early this morning, I took action to immediately suspend both freshman players indefinitely. We expect to learn more about these allegations today. I'm extremely disappointed and want to assure the community that this kind of conduct is unacceptable and does not represent the values of this team or this university.

    http://www.freep.com/story/sports/co...ball/89489270/

    So in less than 24 hours after the incident, they were off the team. Doesn't sound like someone who waited around for higher-ups to tell him what to do.
    It would take, what, 10 minutes to call/talk with his AD ?

  6. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by alchemy2u View Post
    Correct. Fleck drew the line in the sand and it should be obvious to all the players that such conduct will not be tolerated, no need for a hearing. It is easy to say that is what any coach would have done, but obviously that line was not draw by the coaches before the incident.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Kill drew a rigid line in the sand after the Brewster fiasco. Remember those first practices and the intensity that Kill required?

  7. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob_Loblaw View Post
    What you're asking for is illegal. PJ cannot draw a line in the sound regarding consensual sexual activity. It doesn't matter if it's a team rule or however you want to try to circumvent this simple fact. We cannot kick people off the team for engaging in consensual sexual activity. If it is non-consensual. . .it will require a hearing.
    Missionary position only...except for an occasional 69.

  8. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bigticket1 View Post
    So you know that Fleck did not consult with his AD before booting the players ? Or someone higher in the food chain ?

    I couldn't care less who he consulted with. He took it upon himself to kick the players off the team after their behavior didn't meet up to the standards of the WMU program.

  9. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smash em Gophs! View Post
    I couldn't care less who he consulted with. He took it upon himself to kick the players off the team after their behavior didn't meet up to the standards of the WMU program.
    Maybe. Maybe not. We don't know if he made that call or was told to make that call. You are right that it doesn't matter, but you are making that assumption in an effort to defend a point that is otherwise falling apart.

    All coaches can have these issues. PJF, TC, any. It is odd to say our incident was the fault of the "culture" whereas WMU's incident wasn't solely because you want that to be true.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Beetlejuice - Beetlejuice - Beetlejuice

  10. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Spoofin View Post
    Maybe. Maybe not. We don't know if he made that call or was told to make that call. You are right that it doesn't matter, but you are making that assumption in an effort to defend a point that is otherwise falling apart.

    All coaches can have these issues. PJF, TC, any. It is odd to say our incident was the fault of the "culture" whereas WMU's incident wasn't solely because you want that to be true.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    What I want to be true is my alma mater didn't get its name dragged through the mud nationally. That's what I want. I have already said you can't control every kid on a team. That's obvious to anyone who is semi-functional. What you can control is your reaction

    My point isn't falling apart. A couple of you are attempting to make a circular argument. Like it, hate or be indifferent, but TC kept trying to get the kids back on the field. Fleck permanently removed them from the field. It's not difficult and it's not debateable. I will take the proactive coach who sets clear standards for the team. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I can promise you my uncle in NY never heard about the WMU incident because it was swiftly dealt with. That same uncle has asked me many questions about the U fiasco.

  11. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smash em Gophs! View Post
    What I want to be true is my alma mater didn't get its name dragged through the mud nationally. That's what I want. I have already said you can't control every kid on a team. That's obvious to anyone who is semi-functional. What you can control is your reaction

    My point isn't falling apart. A couple of you are attempting to make a circular argument. Like it, hate or be indifferent, but TC kept trying to get the kids back on the field. Fleck permanently removed them from the field. It's not difficult and it's not debateable. I will take the proactive coach who sets clear standards for the team. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I can promise you my uncle in NY never heard about the WMU incident because it was swiftly dealt with. That same uncle has asked me many questions about the U fiasco.
    The stories and known facts weren't the same tho. What you are saying is essentially TC should have thrown the players off the team for being accused even tho they were not charged with a crime and the EOAA's "due process" was still months away? Things may have been much more black/white in WMU's scenario.

    We will agree that the U handled the whole thing terribly. You are blaming the wrong guy, however, IMO.


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    Beetlejuice - Beetlejuice - Beetlejuice

  12. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Spoofin View Post
    The stories and known facts weren't the same tho. What you are saying is essentially TC should have thrown the players off the team for being accused even tho they were not charged with a crime and the EOAA's "due process" was still months away? Things may have been much more black/white in WMU's scenario.

    We will agree that the U handled the whole thing terribly. You are blaming the wrong guy, however, IMO.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    That raises a separate tangent that I'm not sure I've ever seen occur.

    1. Player does thing.

    2. Title IX office (whatever it is at the given school) investigates.

    3. Coach preemptively tosses the player.

    Is that a thing that has occurred anywhere? Is the coach obligated to wait? or would he maybe feel obligated to wait for the Title IX folks to do their thing?

    Coach is in the dark and not in contact with the folks doing the investigation (understandably) so I don't quite get how those very different paths work...

    I'm not really wondering related to our situation, just how these two groups, the coach and Title IX investigators who have no coordination operate ... around each other.

  13. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by BleedGopher View Post
    per the Daily:

    As a new Gophers football coach and athletics director try to change the culture of the program, one football player says the new tone is more serious than that of previous coaches.

    The player spoke with the Daily Friday and asked to remain anonymous to preserve his standing with teammates as he discussed the boycott, how the team has changed under the leadership of new head coach P.J. Fleck, and past run-ins with sexual assault training.

    He said Fleck told the team if any of them are involved in incidents similar to the alleged assault, “there’s no place for you in this program.”

    “The big thing that [Fleck] said was, ‘you can’t change whatever did happen,’” he said. “’But either way, this is the new standard.’”

    This approach to misconduct is more proactive than those taken by former coaches Tracy Claeys and Jerry Kill, the player said. “There’s definitely some walk behind the talk [with Fleck].”

    http://www.mndaily.com/article/2017/...rs-accountable

    Go Gophers!!

    Silly article.
    Your damn right the new regime, and remaining team will be more vigilant.
    The new regime saw what happened to the last, and the remaining players survived it.

  14. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by FireDaveLee View Post
    Back to the article & the anonymous player.....I think if you put the pieces together, you can come up with an educated guess on who it may be.

    I do agree with him that there were probably a few in addition to himself that may not have totally been on board with the boycott, but were afraid to say anything as it would look like they're not supporting their teammates. Peer pressure at it's very highest. I have always maintained that I think the biggest mistake the players made was an "all 10 suspensions reversed or else" ultimatum.

    I do think that the boycott was a success in terms of the attention it brought to the process. They may have had a hearing in planned hearing in January, but I think it would have gone a lot more under the radar. I think it definitely made the U more aware that it was going to be watched in terms of fairness.
    Well, do tell. Using my super-sleuth skills it would more likely be a white player with progressive parents, likely from the metro area. Blake Cashman, Conor Rhoda... your turn.
    "This isn't serious? LSU would motor boat us" -- Trudat
    Sept 3, 2016

  15. #90
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    It's an educated guess; by no means fact. I sent you a PM to my thoughts.

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