8 wins is unrealistic

37score

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There seems to be a fair number of "fans" on here who are expecting Fleck to show up, change the culture, re-institute a whole new program and culture, and expect to have him win 8 games in his first season.

This is simply unrealistic, and really simply for one reason only.

The team has a new leader. With Mitch Leidner graduating, the Gophers are losing not just any QB, but an NFL caliber QB who was probably the winningest QB at Minnesota in 30 years.
Some of you seem to think that veteran leadership accounts for nothing.
Some of you seem to think that just taking a carefully groomed QB who was molded by Claeys and Kill can just be replaced by some high school student who was just recruited who somehow is going to walk in and take the lockerroom leader role, and control the culture of the other 60-80 sophomores, Juniors, and Seniors on the team and guide them as Mitch did.

Mitch wasn't the QB on this team simply because of his ability to run and throw the football. He was identified early as a stand up guy who the rest of the team looked up to when he stood out as a sophomore.
Some of you seem to take this for granted. Sure he had some inconsistencies, but to think a new coach with a new QB is just going to show up as a 100% certainty, and bring equal results in year one of a five year plan is ludicrous.

Just drop it now. You're being unreasonable and you're purposely setting unrealistic expectations for a team that will be short handed at QB and CB for the next couple years.

If you feel you want to be snarky and negative for the next two years, then you are already prescribing your own success in ensuring you'll be disappointed. But that type of attitude has plagued Gopher football for far too long.

Yes, I was bummed to see Claeys be sent away, but I am not going to make unreasonable predictions for a first year coach who's only fault so far was to believe in the University of Minnesota.
 

You need to at least wait a year before going full Mitch.

On GH it seems all Gopher QBs look better in hindsight, but you need more time before going there.
 

How and why would you not expect a better record? If the expectations are not for more success, an unnecessary change was made.
 


Leidner is an NFL quality QB? Ok, let's revisit this next fall, and see if he makes it on an NFL roster (Not just practice squad).


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How and why would you not expect a better record? If the expectations are not for more success, an unnecessary change was made.

I have absolutely no idea what to expect in Flecks first season. How can anyone at this point with the unknowns of QB and the 10 suspended players?
 

This is the funniest post I've ever read on here. I have no doubt that Mitch was a good leader for the team, but his play in key situations really held us back in most games. I think it's pretty much expected that when you start for that long records are going to fall. I couldn't be more excited to see a new qb, it's not like we need an all American back there we just need someone who can make the routine throws. I don't see any reason why the gophers couldn't win 8 games next year, if you have a winning attitude then you wouldn't expect anything else.
 

37score, why did you put "fans" in parenthesis. I don't get it. Are you suggesting someone is not a true fan if they have a different opinion or set of expectations than you?

Go Gophers!!
 

I'm with you. I expect the team to win more than 4 games next year and just want to see the team be competitive and improving. I'll be very curious to see if we go with a young QB that will learn on the job and grow into the position over the next several years. In my view, next year is about establishing a foundation, an identity, and improving. I couldn't care less if we get 5, 6, or 7 wins - anyone that anticipates more wins than that is unrealistic.
 



How and why would you not expect a better record? If the expectations are not for more success, an unnecessary change was made.

1. You need to clean up the program evidently. I haven't read the reports nor do I know all the details of real vs alleged, but evidently those who know more than me believe change was necessary.
2. You would make the change if you through the next hire can provide a higher ceiling knowing you might have a period of 1-3 years where on the field results suffer.
 

Leidner is an NFL quality QB? Ok, let's revisit this next fall, and see if he makes it on an NFL roster (Not just practice squad).


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I don't know if he will ever make a team, but regardless if he does or not, he was a three year starter with leadership ability.

And he was tough.
 

37score, why did you put "fans" in parenthesis. I don't get it. Are you suggesting someone is not a true fan if they have a different opinion or set of expectations than you?

Go Gophers!!

I think there are some "fans" who are so bitter they just want something to bitch about next year since they didn't get their way this year.
I'd like to know what QB they think Claeys was going to use to get us to 8 wins no doubt.
 

There seems to be a fair number of "fans" on here who are expecting Fleck to show up, change the culture, re-institute a whole new program and culture, and expect to have him win 8 games in his first season.

This is simply unrealistic, and really simply for one reason only....

Bull-sheet. Haven't watched a game in years huh?
 



How and why would you not expect a better record? If the expectations are not for more success, an unnecessary change was made.

Why does it have to happen immediately, though? You can have expectations for more success while, at the same, understanding that it may take a couple years for the coach to get is players in and install his systems - you know like has been understood with pretty much every coaching change throughout the history of sports.

Plus - was Claeys going to win 8+ games next year had he not been fired? Comparing the success of Fleck's 2017 Gophers to Claeys' 2016 team is pointless. They are two different teams with different schedules...playing teams that are also different than their 2016 versions...on different days...in different weather...with more or less injuries.
 

There seems to be a fair number of "fans" on here who are expecting Fleck to show up, change the culture, re-institute a whole new program and culture, and expect to have him win 8 games in his first season.

This is simply unrealistic, and really simply for one reason only.

The team has a new leader. With Mitch Leidner graduating, the Gophers are losing not just any QB, but an NFL caliber QB who was probably the winningest QB at Minnesota in 30 years.
Some of you seem to think that veteran leadership accounts for nothing.
Some of you seem to think that just taking a carefully groomed QB who was molded by Claeys and Kill can just be replaced by some high school student who was just recruited who somehow is going to walk in and take the lockerroom leader role, and control the culture of the other 60-80 sophomores, Juniors, and Seniors on the team and guide them as Mitch did.

Mitch wasn't the QB on this team simply because of his ability to run and throw the football. He was identified early as a stand up guy who the rest of the team looked up to when he stood out as a sophomore.
Some of you seem to take this for granted. Sure he had some inconsistencies, but to think a new coach with a new QB is just going to show up as a 100% certainty, and bring equal results in year one of a five year plan is ludicrous.

Just drop it now. You're being unreasonable and you're purposely setting unrealistic expectations for a team that will be short handed at QB and CB for the next couple years.

If you feel you want to be snarky and negative for the next two years, then you are already prescribing your own success in ensuring you'll be disappointed. But that type of attitude has plagued Gopher football for far too long.

Yes, I was bummed to see Claeys be sent away, but I am not going to make unreasonable predictions for a first year coach who's only fault so far was to believe in the University of Minnesota.

Uhhh...didn't Claeys just get 9 wins in his 1st season? Save the negativity until they at least lose the 1st game they were supposed to win- like I do.
 

There seems to be a fair number of "fans" on here who are expecting Fleck to show up, change the culture, re-institute a whole new program and culture, and expect to have him win 8 games in his first season.

This is simply unrealistic, and really simply for one reason only.

The team has a new leader. With Mitch Leidner graduating, the Gophers are losing not just any QB, but an NFL caliber QB who was probably the winningest QB at Minnesota in 30 years.
Some of you seem to think that veteran leadership accounts for nothing.
Some of you seem to think that just taking a carefully groomed QB who was molded by Claeys and Kill can just be replaced by some high school student who was just recruited who somehow is going to walk in and take the lockerroom leader role, and control the culture of the other 60-80 sophomores, Juniors, and Seniors on the team and guide them as Mitch did.

Mitch wasn't the QB on this team simply because of his ability to run and throw the football. He was identified early as a stand up guy who the rest of the team looked up to when he stood out as a sophomore.
Some of you seem to take this for granted. Sure he had some inconsistencies, but to think a new coach with a new QB is just going to show up as a 100% certainty, and bring equal results in year one of a five year plan is ludicrous.

Just drop it now. You're being unreasonable and you're purposely setting unrealistic expectations for a team that will be short handed at QB and CB for the next couple years.

If you feel you want to be snarky and negative for the next two years, then you are already prescribing your own success in ensuring you'll be disappointed. But that type of attitude has plagued Gopher football for far too long.

Yes, I was bummed to see Claeys be sent away, but I am not going to make unreasonable predictions for a first year coach who's only fault so far was to believe in the University of Minnesota.

As one of our more active GH posters likes to point out about himself, "I'm doing all the things and stuff to not accept mediocrity - are you?"
You might want to have a bowl of his Wheaties once in a while.
 

Leidner was at least as good as a redshirt sophomore than he was as a senior. Maybe better. No reason to think that Croft can't be competent as a redshirt sophomore. Especially considering that this almost has to be a more pass-friendly offense than we've had for a few years. And if not Croft, the JUCO. We're not required to start a true freshman QB. If the freshman is better, great. But too many are assuming the older guys we have are terrible and won't be better next fall than they were last fall.
 

Leidner is not an NFL quality QB. If he gets invited to a NFL camp it will be as a tight end.

8 wins is totally realistic. Pretty sure PJ Fleck would be insulted with the suggestion that it is unrealistic. Elite programs win lots of games. That is why they are elite.
 

We were told by Snake the lesser that 9 wins was not good enough and a change had to be made. Why would anything less than that be expected??
 


Let's at least wait until things settle down with the appeals process and after the conclusion of the Fall practices.

Maybe then we can get an idea which QB will separate himself and emerge as team leader. We really don't know how this team will react at this point.

If everybody buys in early, who knows?
 

How and why would you not expect a better record? If the expectations are not for more success, an unnecessary change was made.

If he doesn't win a game next year and wins the conference in year 2, was that a good change?
 

Saying a program is Elite and being Elite are two different things. I have a lot of confidence that PJ can move this program forward in a very good way. However irrespective of one's position on Leidner, we will have a very inexperienced quarterback, and in College that is a big deal. Yes, I know there are exceptions (Penn St), but more examples like Mich St this year. However QB isn't my biggest concern. Secondary is decimated with grad and suspensions. We will have a huge issue stopping the passing game next year. Hell, we had trouble just when Hardin/Bufford were suspended and we were missing our starting corner and backup. Not nearly as good coverage. But with all the suspensions, no Winfield, etc. our defense will struggle stopping the pass constantly. So the combination on inexperienced QB, and limited people in secondary, we will be hard pressed to get to 6 wins first year with PJ. Long term we should expect increase in talent to allow Fleck to be in position to move this program forward.
 

I too think 8 wins is unrealistic. I say at least nine and probably more. Fleck will take care of the QB and db situation and we are off.
 

No, it's not unrealistic. Really, really stupid thread. It's not holding up high expectations so we can be negative if they don't meet them, it's the very fact of having expectations. Having standards and holding people accountable is ok. No one is going to push Fleck off the Washington Ave bridge if they don't win 8, but winning 8 games is not at all unrealistic. We will be favored in at least 6 of the first 7 games (if not all 7, depending on how MSU bounces back) and stealing 1-2 of the last 5 is neither unreasonable nor unrealistic.
 

We were told by Snake the lesser that 9 wins was not good enough and a change had to be made. Why would anything less than that be expected??

Do you take everything told to you this literally?
 

I think it is silly at this point to put any expectations on a win loss record next year because there are way too many variables to factor in with a new QB, new offense, suspended players, first year coach.....

The way the schedule lays out I think the opportunity is there to get to bowl eligibility if things go well but for next year pretty much anything could happen at this point.
 

No, it's not unrealistic. Really, really stupid thread. It's not holding up high expectations so we can be negative if they don't meet them, it's the very fact of having expectations. Having standards and holding people accountable is ok. No one is going to push Fleck off the Washington Ave bridge if they don't win 8, but winning 8 games is not at all unrealistic. We will be favored in at least 6 of the first 7 games (if not all 7, depending on how MSU bounces back) and stealing 1-2 of the last 5 is neither unreasonable nor unrealistic.

Really, really stupid response.

Are you a millennial? You can't be patient for results?

Why do you take a brand new hire (let alone at a School that hadn't won a conference Championship in 40+ years), and expect near Championship results (which 8 or 9 wins might be next year) with a first year starter at QB.

I'm not saying 8 wins is impossible, but it's unrealistic to expect it or else it's failure.
 

I'm with you. I expect the team to win more than 4 games next year and just want to see the team be competitive and improving. I'll be very curious to see if we go with a young QB that will learn on the job and grow into the position over the next several years. In my view, next year is about establishing a foundation, an identity, and improving. I couldn't care less if we get 5, 6, or 7 wins - anyone that anticipates more wins than that is unrealistic.

Have you seen the first 5 games on the schedule ?
 

I think there are some "fans" who are so bitter they just want something to bitch about next year since they didn't get their way this year.
I'd like to know what QB they think Claeys was going to use to get us to 8 wins no doubt.

A - We are replacing Leidner, he was awful last year. The production we got from Rhoda would be more productive than we got from Leidner last year. You live in bizarro world if you are sweating about replacing his production.

B - You're confusing "expectations" with "guarantees". I expect the team to be similar to last year (7-8 regular season wins) and hopefully a bowl victory. I would never say "they are going to get 8 wins no doubt". There is always doubt. I'm a MN sports fan, I have ample amounts of doubt.
 




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