Bacon: Fleck takes WMU recruits with him and other things wrong with college football

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BleedGopher

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per Michigan Public Radio:

The Broncos' former coach, P.J. Fleck, bolted for Minnesota, which gives him a considerable pay raise and a realistic chance to win a national championship. If Minnesota wins the Big Ten, which is no easy task and something they haven't done since the late 1960s, they will likely get into the College Football Playoff and have a shot. Western Michigan proved that even an undefeated season in Kalamazoo will give you that opportunity.

John U. Bacon joined Stateside to talk about the state of Western Michigan football and about Fleck's exit from WMU (which he called a "big mistake"), but not so much why he left, but how he left.

When a coach takes a job at another school, the unwritten rule is that you don't take your recruiting class with you. There's always a couple players who will follow a coach to his new job, but Bacon says Fleck violated that unwritten rule by taking as many as 10 players with him to Minnesota. Players he had originally recruited to play for the Broncos. According to Bacon, you can't blame teenagers for changing their mind, or wanting to follow the coach that recruited them, but 10 is an unusually high number of recruits to take with you and reports are that he was very aggressive in trying to lure them to become Golden Gophers.

Listen to the full interview above to hear about the challenges Fleck's replacement Tim Lester faces and why college football could learn from the newspaper industry's demise.

http://michiganradio.org/post/bacon...esota-and-other-things-wrong-college-football

Go Gophers!!
 

I'd love to hear how they propose to lock these kids into their choice before they even signed.... and if they want to change, the coach should turn their back on them?

The schools don't recruit these kids, the coaches do.

Everyone gets all moralistic about this ****, but if they got their way they'd screw these kids.... so that the fans at another school could be entertained?
 

The only thing they can do is prohibit players from following a coach. WMU recruits could go elsewhere but not Minnesota. Not terribly fair for the players involved.

Pretty sure this guy is not terribly tuned in as he says Fleck and Minnesota have a realistic chance at a national championship.
 

Winnipegopher said:
The only thing they can do is prohibit players from following a coach. WMU recruits could go elsewhere but not Minnesota. Not terribly fair for the players involved.

Pretty sure this guy is not terribly tuned in as he says Fleck and Minnesota have a realistic chance at a national championship.
Click to expand...

The whole thing is that people want these recruits to go to the school they haven't yet signed on for .... so they can entertain them for football.

That seems like a really shaky basis to get all finger waving about.
 

When John Harbaugh, and Urban Meyer joined this league, any notion of gentlemen's agreements when it came to recruiting were thrown out the window. Recruiting is cut throat, as it should be. When a coach's success is determined by the product he puts on the field, why would he deliberately limit himself? All prospects need to be considered fair game, or you're giving your AD ammunition to replace you, as we just witnessed.
 


I don't see what Fleck did as a problem but if thats the case should new coaches be obligated to honor previous coaches offers and commitments? Hey Jimmy you cant go to Minnesota and I also don't want you here good luck kid!

I think the bigger problem is coaches not honoring or pulling offers to players who have committed with a few weeks left before signing day.
 

ELITEEvan said:
I don't see what Fleck did as a problem but if that's the case should new coaches be obligated to honor previous coaches offers and commitments? Hey Jimmy you cant go to Minnesota and I also don't want you here good luck kid!

I think the bigger problem is coaches not honoring or pulling offers to players who have committed with a few weeks left before signing day.
Click to expand...

Do you blame the 10 players for getting an opportunity to play for a P5 program? I agree. I do have a problem with forcing kids that committed to the Gophers under Claeys to decommit this late in the game.

Jerry Kill honored the pre-existing commitments when he took over the program.
 

hungan1 said:
Do you blame the 10 players for getting an opportunity to play for a P5 program? I agree. I do have a problem with forcing kids that committed to the Gophers under Claeys to decommit this late in the game.

Jerry Kill honored the pre-existing commitments when he took over the program.
Click to expand...

He didn't honor all of them.
 




Was there more to the article after the part about a realistic chance to win a championship??? I'm still dreaming after reading that.
 

Sorry, they lost me at, "...a realistic chance to win a national championship."
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
I'd love to hear how they propose to lock these kids into their choice before they even signed.... and if they want to change, the coach should turn their back on them?

The schools don't recruit these kids, the coaches do.

Everyone gets all moralistic about this ****, but if they got their way they'd screw these kids.... so that the fans at another school could be entertained?
Click to expand...

You obviously didn't read anything. The article said the unwritten rule is you don't actively recruits kids to your new job leaving the old one worse off. It's a fair assessment and something most coaches do. I don't think I've ever seen a coach actively try to flip recruits before unless they called him first which they didn't.
 

gopherswinagn said:
You obviously didn't read anything. The article said the unwritten rule is you don't actively recruits kids to your new job leaving the old one worse off. It's a fair assessment and something most coaches do. I don't think I've ever seen a coach actively try to flip recruits before unless they called him first which they didn't.
Click to expand...

The "unwritten rule" doesn't get followed very often at all...

There's nothing moral about the whole situation.

Some folks are just bummed that some kids won't be playing for them....
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
I'd love to hear how they propose to lock these kids into their choice before they even signed.... and if they want to change, the coach should turn their back on them?

The schools don't recruit these kids, the coaches do.

Everyone gets all moralistic about this ****, but if they got their way they'd screw these kids.... so that the fans at another school could be entertained?
Click to expand...

Well stated. The LOI pay be the most one sided contract ever invented.

1. Players don't have to sign it.
2. It basically commits the player to the school for 4-5 years but the school to the player for 1 (and really not one because a school can toss players almost at will).
3. Schools in major conferences financial benefit ridiculously more than the players.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Winnipegopher said:
The only thing they can do is prohibit players from following a coach. WMU recruits could go elsewhere but not Minnesota. Not terribly fair for the players involved.

Pretty sure this guy is not terribly tuned in as he says Fleck and Minnesota have a realistic chance at a national championship.
Click to expand...

Prohibit? Nope, the player has all the control until they sign that LOI......kinda like marriage for men.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

nemo1107 said:
When John Harbaugh, and Urban Meyer joined this league, any notion of gentlemen's agreements when it came to recruiting were thrown out the window. Recruiting is cut throat, as it should be. When a coach's success is determined by the product he puts on the field, why would he deliberately limit himself? All prospects need to be considered fair game, or you're giving your AD ammunition to replace you, as we just witnessed.
Click to expand...

In the words of the late, great and slightly crazy Al Davis......just win baby!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

ELITEEvan said:
I don't see what Fleck did as a problem but if thats the case should new coaches be obligated to honor previous coaches offers and commitments? Hey Jimmy you cant go to Minnesota and I also don't want you here good luck kid!

I think the bigger problem is coaches not honoring or pulling offers to players who have committed with a few weeks left before signing day.
Click to expand...

You absolutely nailed it, happens all the time at every school.

How do folks think Fleck came up with 10 scholarships this close to signing day?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

hungan1 said:
Do you blame the 10 players for getting an opportunity to play for a P5 program? I agree. I do have a problem with forcing kids that committed to the Gophers under Claeys to decommit this late in the game.

Jerry Kill honored the pre-existing commitments when he took over the program.
Click to expand...

Jerry Kill? Let's be completely honest. I'm pretty sure honoring scholarships was far easier for him than it was for Fleck who was coming off a 1 loss season and Cotton Bowl appearance and higher ranked recruiting class.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

gopherswinagn said:
You obviously didn't read anything. The article said the unwritten rule is you don't actively recruits kids to your new job leaving the old one worse off. It's a fair assessment and something most coaches do. I don't think I've ever seen a coach actively try to flip recruits before unless they called him first which they didn't.
Click to expand...

Seen? Why do you believe players jump schools at the last minute. Remember James Lauranitus jump from the Gophers to Ohio State? They (Michigan as well) did the same thing one year later when they called my house. Scholarships open up (evaluations change) and they call the next rated player on the list.

I know first hand schools actively recruit players who have verbally committed to other schools. This is no different.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

gopherswinagn said:
You obviously didn't read anything. The article said the unwritten rule is you don't actively recruits kids to your new job leaving the old one worse off. It's a fair assessment and something most coaches do. I don't think I've ever seen a coach actively try to flip recruits before unless they called him first which they didn't.
Click to expand...

Unwritten rules are unwritten, and not rules. Otherwise they would be written, and rules.
 


All's fair in love and war. Some days you're the bug, and some days you're the windshield. We were on the other end of it when Lou Holtz left for Notre Dame, taking Tony Rice, other prized recruits and his favorite assistant coaches with him. I've always mourned that it happened, but I've never called it "what's wrong with college football" or whined that the system shouldn't allow it. Whiners gonna whine.
 


What goes around comes around. What do you think Coach Sawvil will do if and when he is affirmed at Wake Forest? What do think Jerry Kill would do if he could right now at Rutgers, if there was someone he recruited while he was still here? Kill would have honored the unwritten rule with his protege Claeys, but he has made it clear he is not happy with the U right now. Fact is Rutgers? Wake Forest football?

We need to hang on to coach Fleck for as long as possible by the way. What do you think he would do if he moves to another school? Hopefully, 15 years from now, Fleck's next job is with the NFL. There is a written rule about taking freshmen college recruits to the NFL.
 


This is dumb because there is no 'unwritten rule'. It happens often. What is rare is the number and that's for a few reasons:
Usually when a HC goes to another school its a step up. Usually that means most of the guys the HC recruited for his previous school aren't guys he thinks can play at his new school OR he doesn't think most of them are better than the guys committed at his new school. Also, Fleck is renowned as a recruiter meaning its quite possible he simply has more guys capable of playing B1G FB than you typically see in this situation. Also, our recruiting class wasn't close to being full AND wasn't very highly thought of so there may have been more slots to fill either from just open schollies or guys being moved on from than normal. Coaches coach to win. Not too many will say 'these guys I recruited at my old job would really help me at my new one but I won't even place that call out of respect'. My guess is Fleck may be a bit rare too in that these guys were just willing to follow him immediately.
 

Atl Gopher said:
What goes around comes around. What do you think Coach Sawvil will do if and when he is affirmed at Wake Forest? What do think Jerry Kill would do if he could right now at Rutgers, if there was someone he recruited while he was still here? Kill would have honored the unwritten rule with his protege Claeys, but he has made it clear he is not happy with the U right now. Fact is Rutgers? Wake Forest football?
Click to expand...

Honestly, they should be doing that. I see no problem with it. Happens all the time.
 

John U. Bacon is a wuss and a Michigan fan. He is still under the delusion that Michigan does things the right way.
 

I'm really angry and upset that Fleck took all of those poor WMU recruits that were going to WMU because it's such a great school and not because of Fleck.

I will, however, feel much better about it after we hoist that College Football Playoff National Championship Trophy presented by Dr. Pepper! Ski-u-Mah!
 

Sportsfan24 said:
Well stated. The LOI pay be the most one sided contract ever invented.

1. Players don't have to sign it.
2. It basically commits the player to the school for 4-5 years but the school to the player for 1 (and really not one because a school can toss players almost at will).
3. Schools in major conferences financial benefit ridiculously more than the players.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
So find an alternative for playing football if that's the goal. Clearly the debt-free degree and lifetime earnings bump associated with it mean nothing.
 

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