Big STrib profile: Minnesota basketball talent boom bypassing Gophers so far

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Cayman said:
Oh yeah, if people think ruppert is bad here, imagine a small army of Gopher fans just eagle-eyeing Buckyville and reporting their findings here on a daily basis. I remember the day it was announced that they got a 2 seed in the 2014 NCAA tournament, there was a thread on the front page about us going to the NIT.
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I've always wondered if they have some kind of program that automatically alerts them when Wisconsin is mentioned on this site. They'll tell you we are obsessed with them and that the Gophers are irrelevant but then constantly have multiple threads about us on their front page.
 

BleedGopher said:
Which is ironic as last year wisconsin didn't sign Stone or Ellenson, two of the highest rated kids in state history.

Go Gophers!!
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True, yet WI finished farther along in the NCAA tourney than either player's team (Wojo has yet to make the NCAAs).
 



Marcus may be a decent writer and a good beat guy but this article is essentially the encapsulation of what I dislike about him.

He cares waaaay too much about the local guys. It's the most Minnesotan thing ever that we only want OUR guys and care way more about keeping the hometown kids than finding talent.

I'm not his editor so I have no idea if he's being pushed in that direction and told to focus all his efforts into the local kids rather than the expansive recruing board but it's frustrating.

I don't think it's a "Marcus is joining the Strip's dark side and ripping the Gophers" rather I think he would've changed the entire scope of the article had they landed the two CP kids. I'd bet that in a hypothetical world where the Gophers land the two CP kids rather than Washington and whoever else, his story paints this recruiting cycle as a smashing success.

That's the local propaganda that he's spewing and again, I don't know if he's being told to take that approach but I hate it.

So many schools don't "lock down their borders" and find guys from elsewhere. For some reason it just seems like in all sports, Minnesotans just care so much more about fellow Minnesotans than other places.
 


DeathClutch said:
FWIW the headline in the physical paper is Gophers Recruiting Woes: A border with leaks. To be fair, the second part is true but the first part is absolutely false. The article takes up half of the front page and the entire back page of the sports section. Just unnecessary.

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I thought he did a thorough and balanced job of explaining the situation. He writes much better than Amelia and appears to be more plugged in. Part of the reason that the story got so much space is that there was a lot of space available. It was midweek between vikings games, the twins aren't worthy of a syllable, the gophers are on a bye and the wolves and wild haven't started yet. It was a well told story with not a lot of competition for space, so the editors probably didn't pinch it much.
 

An alternate story line certainly could have been "the commitment of highly-rated Washington pushes Wright to plan B in Dayton.
 

Vander Blue was a commit until the WI academic support folks visited him and his family and outlined what he needed to do in academics.
He then enrolled at Marquette and was ill advised by his posse, entered the draft early and I have no knowledge where he is playing now.
Stone was told early that he needed to upgrade his academics to be admitted. His dad sudenly got a job in MD and Stone went there.
If there is a secret cable to your mom's basement in the metropolis of Bemidiji from the WI academic admission office then you must have info that no one else has.
 

BleedGopher said:
Which is ironic as last year wisconsin didn't sign Stone or Ellenson, two of the highest rated kids in state history.
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Looking at Wisconsin’s in-state recruiting using 247sports:

2008: 0-2 (Lucious, Mitchell)
2009: 0-3 (Wilson, Maymon, Oliver) --- Wiscy had 2 scholarships to give
2011: 0-3 (Jesperson, Breunig, Mobley) --- 4 scholarships to give
2013: 1-6 (Thomas, Wilson Jr., Fischer, Fuller, Thompson) --- 5 scholarships to give
2014: 0-5 (Looney, Cohen, LaChance, Ellingson, Iduwe)
2015: 1-5 (Stone, Ellenson, Heldt, Noskowiak) --- 5 scholarships to give
2016: 0-3 (Hauser, Antetokounmpo, Lucas)

Hmm, looks like the Bo Ryan regime has done fairly poorly in recent years in signing high-major bound in-state recruits. The Madison newspapers must have absolutely roasted Bo over this. Oh, wait….they have been extremely successful so most people probably don't give a sh!t.

Nobody will care where the players are from if Pitino can start winning. But that’s the “if.”
 



GibsonSG said:
Looking at Wisconsin’s in-state recruiting using 247sports:

2008: 0-2 (Lucious, Mitchell)
2009: 0-3 (Wilson, Maymon, Oliver) --- Wiscy had 2 scholarships to give
2011: 0-3 (Jesperson, Breunig, Mobley) --- 4 scholarships to give
2013: 1-6 (Thomas, Wilson Jr., Fischer, Fuller, Thompson) --- 5 scholarships to give
2014: 0-5 (Looney, Cohen, LaChance, Ellingson, Iduwe)
2015: 1-5 (Stone, Ellenson, Heldt, Noskowiak) --- 5 scholarships to give
2016: 0-3 (Hauser, Antetokounmpo, Lucas)

Hmm, looks like the Bo Ryan regime has done fairly poorly in recent years in signing high-major bound in-state recruits. The Madison newspapers must have absolutely roasted Bo over this. Oh, wait….they have been extremely successful so most people probably don't give a sh!t.

Nobody will care where the players are from if Pitino can start winning. But that’s the “if.”
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I hit the Badgers with the best of them but you have to give them Deker in 2012 as a strong get for a wi kid
 

GibsonSG said:
Looking at Wisconsin’s in-state recruiting using 247sports:

2008: 0-2 (Lucious, Mitchell)
2009: 0-3 (Wilson, Maymon, Oliver) --- Wiscy had 2 scholarships to give
2011: 0-3 (Jesperson, Breunig, Mobley) --- 4 scholarships to give
2013: 1-6 (Thomas, Wilson Jr., Fischer, Fuller, Thompson) --- 5 scholarships to give
2014: 0-5 (Looney, Cohen, LaChance, Ellingson, Iduwe)
2015: 1-5 (Stone, Ellenson, Heldt, Noskowiak) --- 5 scholarships to give
2016: 0-3 (Hauser, Antetokounmpo, Lucas)

Hmm, looks like the Bo Ryan regime has done fairly poorly in recent years in signing high-major bound in-state recruits. The Madison newspapers must have absolutely roasted Bo over this. Oh, wait….they have been extremely successful so most people probably don't give a sh!t.

Nobody will care where the players are from if Pitino can start winning. But that’s the “if.”
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Great post, I appreciate the research you put in to it. The Badgers do a great job of recruiting to their system and also working on skill development on a yearly basis. Obviously they've landed a few big time in state kids (Dekker, Koenig), but not as many as you'd think they would given their success.
 

GibsonSG said:
Looking at Wisconsin’s in-state recruiting using 247sports:

2008: 0-2 (Lucious, Mitchell)
2009: 0-3 (Wilson, Maymon, Oliver) --- Wiscy had 2 scholarships to give
2011: 0-3 (Jesperson, Breunig, Mobley) --- 4 scholarships to give
2013: 1-6 (Thomas, Wilson Jr., Fischer, Fuller, Thompson) --- 5 scholarships to give
2014: 0-5 (Looney, Cohen, LaChance, Ellingson, Iduwe)
2015: 1-5 (Stone, Ellenson, Heldt, Noskowiak) --- 5 scholarships to give
2016: 0-3 (Hauser, Antetokounmpo, Lucas)

Hmm, looks like the Bo Ryan regime has done fairly poorly in recent years in signing high-major bound in-state recruits. The Madison newspapers must have absolutely roasted Bo over this. Oh, wait….they have been extremely successful so most people probably don't give a sh!t.

Nobody will care where the players are from if Pitino can start winning. But that’s the “if.”
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There also seemed to be very little backlash over Bo's extramarital affair. I can only imagine how that would go over in the media if one of our coaches was caught doing such a thing, in a market where not filling filling up a rental car gas tank and approved extra expenditures on jet travel in the process of getting some nice results on the recruiting trail is a sign of reckless entitlement and irresponsibility, and is front page news.

In the name of objectivity though, I'm pretty sure Wisconsin did not offer all the guys you listed. In particular, I don't think they offered Fischer, Cohen, or Noskowiak, despite some of them being rated as high as 4 stars.
 

GibsonSG said:
Looking at Wisconsin’s in-state recruiting using 247sports:

2008: 0-2 (Lucious, Mitchell)
2009: 0-3 (Wilson, Maymon, Oliver) --- Wiscy had 2 scholarships to give
2011: 0-3 (Jesperson, Breunig, Mobley) --- 4 scholarships to give
2013: 1-6 (Thomas, Wilson Jr., Fischer, Fuller, Thompson) --- 5 scholarships to give
2014: 0-5 (Looney, Cohen, LaChance, Ellingson, Iduwe)
2015: 1-5 (Stone, Ellenson, Heldt, Noskowiak) --- 5 scholarships to give
2016: 0-3 (Hauser, Antetokounmpo, Lucas)

Hmm, looks like the Bo Ryan regime has done fairly poorly in recent years in signing high-major bound in-state recruits. The Madison newspapers must have absolutely roasted Bo over this. Oh, wait….they have been extremely successful so most people probably don't give a sh!t.

Nobody will care where the players are from if Pitino can start winning. But that’s the “if.”
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Bo did not get roasted because the Badgers did not offer a majority of those players. Stone and Ellenson are the only 2 on the list who I know had offers. Both definitely could have helped the Badgers but the Badgers were up against it in both cases. I may be missing one or two others. Many aren't able to get in to school. Koenig chose the Badgers over Duke, Carolina and Kansas. Dekker shut his recruitment down early.
 



GVBadger said:
Bo did not get roasted because the Badgers did not offer a majority of those players. Stone and Ellenson are the only 2 on the list who I know had offers. Both definitely could have helped the Badgers but the Badgers were up against it in both cases. I may be missing one or two others. Many aren't able to get in to school. Koenig chose the Badgers over Duke, Carolina and Kansas. Dekker shut his recruitment down early.
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I am not saying Bo’s recruitment of Wisconsin kids has been lousy and I know he didn’t offer all of these players. The point was that you don’t see people criticizing Bo for the lack of Wisconsin kids on the roster because of all the success he’s had. (And sure, you will always have some people whining when the 5 star kids leave state. He wasn’t immune to that, but who is?) Now, if Wisconsin had been a middling, lucky to scratch the bubble team his whole tenure or worse, I’m sure you would have heard, “Bo Ryan is all too often a failure at landing Wisconsin’s best talent” and “why isn’t he recruiting these guys?” out of the media and fans.
 

It seems the discussion again is now about how differently (unfairly ?) WI newspapers treated Bo Ryan compared to the recent column in a MN newspaper.
Yes, there was very little or no criticism of Bo when highly recruited WIl BB players signed elsewhere .
The answer to that is Ryan's record at WI.
BIG Championships, repeated NCAA appearances, two final fours, a minimum of player misbehavior, etc over his career at WI made the fans and the beat writers trust Bo.
For WI fans to see IN fans storm the court because they beat WI was an unbelievable sight after prior years of WI BB mediocrity.
His affair was a personal matter that did not involve the University in any way.
Get a coach that wins like Ryan and the MN newspapers will treat him like WI papers treated Bo.
 

olddoc said:
It seems the discussion again is now about how differently (unfairly ?) WI newspapers treated Bo Ryan compared to the recent column in a MN newspaper.
Yes, there was very little or no criticism of Bo when highly recruited WIl BB players signed elsewhere .
The answer to that is Ryan's record at WI.
BIG Championships, repeated NCAA appearances, two final fours, a minimum of player misbehavior, etc over his career at WI made the fans and the beat writers trust Bo.
For WI fans to see IN fans storm the court because they beat WI was an unbelievable sight after prior years of WI BB mediocrity.
His affair was a personal matter that did not involve the University in any way.
Get a coach that wins like Ryan and the MN newspapers will treat him like WI papers treated Bo.
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The point is all programs miss on local players all the time. Wins and losses are ultimately what matters. Criticize Pitino for the lack of wins. The best programs and coaches are never going to get every local recruit.
 


GibsonSG said:
I am not saying Bo’s recruitment of Wisconsin kids has been lousy and I know he didn’t offer all of these players. The point was that you don’t see people criticizing Bo for the lack of Wisconsin kids on the roster because of all the success he’s had. (And sure, you will always have some people whining when the 5 star kids leave state. He wasn’t immune to that, but who is?) Now, if Wisconsin had been a middling, lucky to scratch the bubble team his whole tenure or worse, I’m sure you would have heard, “Bo Ryan is all too often a failure at landing Wisconsin’s best talent” and “why isn’t he recruiting these guys?” out of the media and fans.
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Good clarification, thanks. The big difference is he would evaluate a player, decide whether or not to offer and then very rarely ever change his mind. It makes it much cleaner.

Pitino brings some of it on himself. For example, if Reuvers is for some reason not a fit for how he wants to play, then simply don't offer. It is much easier to defend not offering then offering and then really not trying hard to get him. You either want him or you don't. And offering Davison at the last minute gives the impression you don't trust your evaluation process. I think everyone understands you can't offer everyone.
 

GVBadger said:
Good clarification, thanks. The big difference is he would evaluate a player, decide whether or not to offer and then very rarely ever change his mind. It makes it much cleaner.

Pitino brings some of it on himself. For example, if Reuvers is for some reason not a fit for how he wants to play, then simply don't offer. It is much easier to defend not offering then offering and then really not trying hard to get him. You either want him or you don't. And offering Davison at the last minute gives the impression you don't trust your evaluation process. I think everyone understands you can't offer everyone.
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I agree with what you're saying but... If Pitino or any other gopher coach doesn't offer a MN kid the startribune would run an article titled "Gopher Coach Doesn't Even Try" Or something to that effect.
 

GVBadger said:
Good clarification, thanks. The big difference is he would evaluate a player, decide whether or not to offer and then very rarely ever change his mind. It makes it much cleaner.

Pitino brings some of it on himself. For example, if Reuvers is for some reason not a fit for how he wants to play, then simply don't offer. It is much easier to defend not offering then offering and then really not trying hard to get him. You either want him or you don't. And offering Davison at the last minute gives the impression you don't trust your evaluation process. I think everyone understands you can't offer everyone.
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According to 247 sports, the Gophers offered Reuvers 5 days after Wisconsin did. They offered Davidson about a month after Wisconsin. My understanding is both of them were late bloomers. That is probably why the Gophers offered so late, and they weren't that far behind the Badgers.
 

Tim1406 said:
I agree with what you're saying but... If Pitino or any other gopher coach doesn't offer a MN kid the startribune would run an article titled "Gopher Coach Doesn't Even Try" Or something to that effect.
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That's exactly it. The state high school coaches would have a very public cow about that.
 

What I didn't like in the article is the number of times Minnesota was late in offering players compared to other comparable universities. It makes me wonder about the scouting.

Article mentions Davison, Sims, Ruevers, etc. all blowing up late. Minnesota should have the easiest time watching these players, doesn't anyone scouting have the foresight to see that coming? They never make an offer and get aggressive recruiting until the player is already blowing up nationally and moving up the rankings. Makes you think they are relying on scouting services rankings more than their own scouting.
 

CourtneyJames4 said:
What I didn't like in the article is the number of times Minnesota was late in offering players compared to other comparable universities. It makes me wonder about the scouting.

Article mentions Davison, Sims, Ruevers, etc. all blowing up late. Minnesota should have the easiest time watching these players, doesn't anyone scouting have the foresight to see that coming? They never make an offer and get aggressive recruiting until the player is already blowing up nationally and moving up the rankings. Makes you think they are relying on scouting services rankings more than their own scouting.
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We were Washington's first offer. Hamidou Diallo is a top 10 recruit now, and we were his first offer too. Sid Wilson is teammate of Washington's who reclassified to 2018, now a top 50 recruit in his class according to scout, I'd bet we were his first offer too. Were we Gabe Kalscheur's first offer? We got in on Oturu pretty early.

Davison had some offers earlier, mostly mid majors like Northern Iowa or UW Milwaukee. I don't think he got much high major interest until the spring. And Washington is ranked higher anyway, we identified him early and got him. I think Reuvers and Sims were both "0 star" recruits less than a year ago.
 

CourtneyJames4 said:
What I didn't like in the article is the number of times Minnesota was late in offering players compared to other comparable universities. It makes me wonder about the scouting.

Article mentions Davison, Sims, Ruevers, etc. all blowing up late. Minnesota should have the easiest time watching these players, doesn't anyone scouting have the foresight to see that coming? They never make an offer and get aggressive recruiting until the player is already blowing up nationally and moving up the rankings. Makes you think they are relying on scouting services rankings more than their own scouting.
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I think that it may be more that a 17 yo kid actually improves or physically matures by a significant amount late into his high school career. These aren't static entities that are being evaluated. Pair late bloom with a skill set that is not perfect for an uptempo design and you have an answer for why an offer doesn't come early.




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olddoc said:
Vander Blue was a commit until the WI academic support folks visited him and his family and outlined what he needed to do in academics.
He then enrolled at Marquette and was ill advised by his posse, entered the draft early and I have no knowledge where he is playing now.
Stone was told early that he needed to upgrade his academics to be admitted. His dad sudenly got a job in MD and Stone went there.
If there is a secret cable to your mom's basement in the metropolis of Bemidiji from the WI academic admission office then you must have info that no one else has.
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Oh...so you were in the living room with Vander Blue?

Were you also on the conference call with Stone informing him about his academic status?

Shut the **** up. Keep believing in your made up stories, I really don't care. Just do it somewhere else.
 

olddoc said:
It seems the discussion again is now about how differently (unfairly ?) WI newspapers treated...
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What was the coverage of the Clement incident?

Story 1 from host.madison.com
"University of Wisconsin football coach Paul Chryst declined to say whether or not running back Corey Clement was suspended for Saturday’s game but said having him not travel with the team to Minnesota “was the right thing to do.”

“I talked to Corey Wednesday and kind of visited with him and decided he wasn’t going to make the trip,” Chryst said. “He just wasn’t going to play.”

Story 2 from jsonline.
The fight he instigated in November in his apartment complex and the subsequent lie he told to head coach Paul Chryst and running backs coach John Settle — that he had come to the rescue of a security guard who had been assaulted.
(RB Coach) John Settle also discussed the matter with the Journal Sentinel and did not mince words.

“I think any time there is an air of deception, that is the thing that concerns you,” he said. “With me, honesty is very important … Telling the truth is always important."

Wow...they really took him to the woodshed. Just like the did for Bo banging some chick. And you think that the papers don't treat these institutions differently?

Keep believing your lies.


 

olddoc said:
Vander Blue was a commit until the WI academic support folks visited him and his family and outlined what he needed to do in academics.
He then enrolled at Marquette and was ill advised by his posse, entered the draft early and I have no knowledge where he is playing now.
Stone was told early that he needed to upgrade his academics to be admitted. His dad sudenly got a job in MD and Stone went there.
If there is a secret cable to your mom's basement in the metropolis of Bemidiji from the WI academic admission office then you must have info that no one else has.
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The Butthurt is strong with you as your mom sucks my six figure cock in my Lake Calhoun condo
 

GVBadger said:
Bo did not get roasted because the Badgers did not offer a majority of those players. Stone and Ellenson are the only 2 on the list who I know had offers. Both definitely could have helped the Badgers but the Badgers were up against it in both cases. I may be missing one or two others. Many aren't able to get in to school. Koenig chose the Badgers over Duke, Carolina and Kansas. Dekker shut his recruitment down early.
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Looking at the list they definitely offered Looney as well, but that's about it. And it looks like things are pretty good on the in-state front with Kobe King and Tyler Herro committed. If they can land Joey Hauser that's pretty solid.
 

Radio Badger said:
Looking at the list they definitely offered Looney as well, but that's about it. And it looks like things are pretty good on the in-state front with Kobe King and Tyler Herro committed. If they can land Joey Hauser that's pretty solid.
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you are quoting a fellow badger fan about badger sports. do you not have your own board?
 

Wisconsin is Stanford when a recruit decides their style sucks.lol
 

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