ESPN Blog topic: "Top 5 All-Time Coaches" at each Big Ten school

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They're being released alphabetically, and Minnesota hasn't been published yet. They're up to Michigan State.

Who are our top 5, and how would you rank them?
 

1. Bierman - 5 NC's, 7 Conf Champs, .727 win %
2. Williams - 1 NC, 8 Conf Champs, .786 win %
3. Warmath - 1 NC, 2 Conf Champs, .526 win %
4. Mason - 1st 10 win season, 7 bowl appearances, .529 win %
5. Not sure - Stoll (1 bowl appearance, .500 win %), Kill (3 bowl appearances,.490 win %)

Hard to compare across eras, CFB has changed so much over the years even from the 70's to now.
 

I am a big fan of both Stoll and JK and I would rate it a toss up, maybe with JK getting the nod because he cleaned up an absolute academic mess quickly and helped generate more outside support. (I was attending the U while Stoll was coach and he got a hell of a lot out of very average talent running the veer his first few years.) They both inherited depleted rosters, had great staffs and had to recruit and coach against helmet teams with a lot better recruiting areas and budgets. JK got a lot more administrative support, (by U standards), but a lot of that was due to his ability to articulate what needed to be done. I believe Giel hired Stoll, so he does get credit for getting that right. What Giel does not get credit for is understanding how good Stoll was and that the game had become as much about resources as coaches at that point.They both worked for ADs who were fine people, but who were either convinced or were told there would be no more resources for athletics so just make do. They both also made a fatal mistake in firing a good coach without a good backup lined up or the personal knowledge of coaching required to find one. Maturi's firing decision was a lot worse than Giel's. Giel hired Joe Salem who was a good coach but did not know how to recruit the Midwest or at a B1G level, he just ran out of guys Stoll recruited and that was it. Maturi hired a guy who was a complete fraud as anything other than a salesman. He did not know how to evaluate talent.
Stoll was a terrific recruiter, knew the Midwest and Michigan in particular really well and was very good at talent evaluation.
Getting into bowls was tougher in Stoll's era. His best team was basically wrecked by injuries.
I would say JK did a better job of enlisting support from regular folks, but he had an advantage. Stoll replaced Warmath whose record faded when the helmet schools especially Mich, OSU, Neb, etc. put big emphasis on football and we did not. Warmath had won a national championship a decade earlier, and the B1G co-championship in '67 (with Indiana and Purdue) 3-4 years earlier. People just thought he had gotten too old. No one had any idea at the time how far we were falling behind by failing to put money into the program. In contrast, by the time JK got here it was clear a lot of things were wrong. Nobody who paid any attention at all to college football could argue with his explanation of what had to be done.
Stoll was a great one on one salesman and relationship guy, and good, but not JK good at selling change. JK was that and the best spokesman for the athletic dept there has ever been, and it is not close.
They were the two times we got lucky in the coach hiring lottery in my adult lifetime.
I have no idea if TC can do the PR part of the job, although I think his sincerity and low key sense of humor could grow on people. But what I can say for sure that he is a good coach, and Coyle better have a great plan if he ever decides to make a change because picking the right guy is a real crap shoot for most ADs. Picking the wrong guy is a 5-10 year setback for schools not in rich talent areas.
 

We just didn't have 5 top coaches. We had 3.

And an honorable mention for a few other guys.
 

ESPN put out their list:
1. Bierman
2. Williams
3. Warmath
4. Spears
5. Mason
 


Here is the list. On Mason:

5. Glen Mason, 1997-2006 (64-57)

Only three Minnesota coaches -- Bierman, Warmath and Williams -- worked at Minnesota longer or had more wins. He guided the Gophers to seven bowl games in 10 years, and he became the Big Ten Coach of the Year in 1999 after Minnesota made its first bowl in 13 years. He helped transform the program from a perennial cellar dweller into a middle-of-the-pack Big Ten team. Since 1951, no Minnesota coach has had a better career winning percentage (.529).

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/133880/top-5-all-time-coaches-minnesota-golden-gophers

Go Gophers!!
 

1) Bierman
2) Doc Henry
3) Warmeth
No doubt about those if we keep it strictly to gopher tenures I would rate Stoll 4th, had a 6-2 conference season, was mostly .500 in conference and coached in an era where we played tough teams out of conference. I think he would've racked up a lot of 8-10 win seasons by today's standards. Mason 5th, he made the program respectable again in the late 90's and early 2000's after decades of futility. It was close between Kill and Mason, but Mason had more signature wins than Kill. I do give Kill credit for cleaning up after Brewster and laying a great foundation for Claeys to take over, there seems to be a winning culture over there that everyone is buying into, it's unfortunate Kill won't get to see it through.
 

:)
4. Salem
3. Brewster
2. Wacker
1. Lou Holtz
 

Ski U Master said:
ESPN put out their list:
1. Bierman
2. Williams
3. Warmath
4. Spears
5. Mason
Click to expand...

I can't really argue with the list. I forgot about Clarence Spears. Even though he was only at the U for 5 years he did have a .757 winning percentage. I didn't realize he also was the head coach at Wisconsin after Minnesota (he bounced around a lot - Dartmouth, West VA, U of M, Oregon, UW, Toledo and Maryland). Coaching at both schools has to drop him down, right? Though he was 1-3 against MN at UW, so maybe that puts him back up again??? :)
 



Lakeville Goldy said:
I can't really argue with the list. I forgot about Clarence Spears. Even though he was only at the U for 5 years he did have a .757 winning percentage. I didn't realize he also was the head coach at Wisconsin after Minnesota (he bounced around a lot - Dartmouth, West VA, U of M, Oregon, UW, Toledo and Maryland). Coaching at both schools has to drop him down, right? Though he was 1-3 against MN at UW, so maybe that puts him back up again??? :)
Click to expand...
Spears recruited Nagurski, so that counts for something.

When I was doing my list I didn't really look too much farther back than the 40's, so difficult to know what the competition was actually like then.
 

Ski U Master said:
Spears recruited Nagurski, so that counts for something.

When I was doing my list I didn't really look too much farther back than the 40's, so difficult to know what the competition was actually like then.
Click to expand...

I really thought Stoll or Kill would make the list, or even Holtz, based on his career credentials. I confess that Spears wasn't even on my top-of-the-head list. That was a good call, though.
 

ESPN got it right. I hope they do a worst five list. It will be easy to come up with five but the order will be interesting.
 

MNGoldenGophers1 said:
ESPN got it right. I hope they do a worst five list. It will be easy to come up with five but the order will be interesting.
Click to expand...
Here's a stab at it
1. Brewster - .333 win %, 2 bowl losses, 0 pigs, 0 axes, 0 jugs, 1 win vs top 25 (#24)
2. Wacker - .291 Win %, 0 bowls, 1 pig, 2 axes, 0 jugs, 2 wins vs top 25 (#15, #23)
3. Salem - .352 win %, 0 bowls, 3 pigs, 0 axes, 0 jugs, 2 wins vs top 25 (#6,#18)
4. Gutenkunst - .441 win %, 1 bowl loss, 1 bowl win ('85 interim), 2 pigs, 4 axes, 1 jug, 2 wins vs top 25 (#2, #13)
5. Holtz - .455 win %, 1 bowl win, 1 axe, 1 pig, 0 jugs, 0 wins vs top 25, ditched for Notre Dame
 




Ski U Master said:
Here's a stab at it
1. Brewster - .333 win %, 2 bowl losses, 0 pigs, 0 axes, 0 jugs, 1 win vs top 25 (#24)
2. Wacker - .291 Win %, 0 bowls, 1 pig, 2 axes, 0 jugs, 2 wins vs top 25 (#15, #23)
3. Salem - .352 win %, 0 bowls, 3 pigs, 0 axes, 0 jugs, 2 wins vs top 25 (#6,#18)
4. Gutenkunst - .441 win %, 1 bowl loss, 1 bowl win ('85 interim), 2 pigs, 4 axes, 1 jug, 2 wins vs top 25 (#2, #13)
5. Holtz - .455 win %, 1 bowl win, 1 axe, 1 pig, 0 jugs, 0 wins vs top 25, ditched for Notre Dame
Click to expand...

Wacker was the worst. To add to the list of stats - Wacker had a .200 big ten win %, Brewster was .222. Wacker's top season was 4 wins. At least Brewster had 6 and 7 win seasons. I had season tickets for both coaches and I'd say Wacker was the worst, Brewster 2nd worst.
 



Word said:
Wacker was the worst. To add to the list of stats - Wacker had a .200 big ten win %, Brewster was .222. Wacker's top season was 4 wins. At least Brewster had 6 and 7 win seasons. I had season tickets for both coaches and I'd say Wacker was the worst, Brewster 2nd worst.
Click to expand...

I knew these three would create some debate. Both you and skiU make good cases. Here's some food for thought: I was around for the Salem era and the glorious game against Nebraska which by itself could be an argument for Smoke'n Joe to get #1 spot.
 

Word said:
Wacker was the worst. To add to the list of stats - Wacker had a .200 big ten win %, Brewster was .222. Wacker's top season was 4 wins. At least Brewster had 6 and 7 win seasons. I had season tickets for both coaches and I'd say Wacker was the worst, Brewster 2nd worst.
Click to expand...
I had Brewster at #2 at first, but the rivalry games mean a lot to me personally so because he was the only one on the list without at least 1 I moved him up.

Keep in mind that Brewster also had more games to deal with, so the win totals can be skewed. Those extra games aren't against top competition, and his performance against 1-AA teams hurts him as well.

Just my thoughts, but I didn't live through the Wacker era.
 



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