Way to Early 2016 Draft for Big Ten

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Most only do the first round this early, so it's not surprising to see no Gophers listed.
 

Only Gopher even in 1st round consideration is probably Murray. Honestly I haven't seen a better corner than him in the last year so my guess is its the combo of lack of respect for MN, lack of INT numbers, not being a return man, and maybe questions about overall speed and athleticism holding him back.
 

Nate said:
Most only do the first round this early, so it's not surprising to see no Gophers listed.
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Agreed! Murray would be a first round consideration, if he had gaudier interception numbers, he's very likely an early second round pick with Brien Boddy-Calhoun a late second early third.
 

nsmike said:
Agreed! Murray would be a first round consideration, if he had gaudier interception numbers, he's very likely an early second round pick with Brien Boddy-Calhoun a late second early third.
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Dont know. BBC doesn't have great size so he'll need to prove his speed. There are teams like the Vikes that simply wont take a corner if hes under 6' or whatever their cut off is. He also got beat from time to time last year and needs to tighten that up. He will get drafted but it may be closer to the middle rounds
 


My opinion right now, unless he runs a Michael carter-ish 4.7 BBC will be drafted ahead of Murray. Feel free to disagree. I reserve the right to revise this prediction
 

Pompous Elitist said:
My opinion right now, unless he runs a Michael carter-ish 4.7 BBC will be drafted ahead of Murray. Feel free to disagree. I reserve the right to revise this prediction
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What brings you to that thought? Murray has had 2 excellent years, is bigger and longer, and widely regarded as the better cover guy.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
My opinion right now, unless he runs a Michael carter-ish 4.7 BBC will be drafted ahead of Murray. Feel free to disagree. I reserve the right to revise this prediction
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I don't know if he'll be drafted higher, but I also thought BBC was the better corner last year.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
I don't know if he'll be drafted higher, but I also thought BBC was the better corner last year.
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I don't know how that's the case. BBC definitely made more big plays but Murray still locked down an entire side of the field which allowed for more coverage help there. Murray also had an excellent year against the run and really held up on that boundary. BBC played really well but (like most cbs) got beat at times. Murray was basically a shut down corner for most of the year and for the past 2 years teams have actively avoided throwing at him. Don't really know what else you want from a corner
 



oleboy41 said:
I don't know how that's the case. BBC definitely made more big plays but Murray still locked down an entire side of the field which allowed for more coverage help there. Murray also had an excellent year against the run and really held up on that boundary. BBC played really well but (like most cbs) got beat at times. Murray was basically a shut down corner for most of the year and for the past 2 years teams have actively avoided throwing at him. Don't really know what else you want from a corner
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Interceptions. Must have more interceptions. that's all that matters as a CB

/s
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
I don't know if he'll be drafted higher, but I also thought BBC was the better corner last year.
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BBC certainly seems to make more big plays & has great leadership skills. He basically had a pick in every practice this Spring and he holds court on the sidelines with the younger guys asking him questions and getting pointers. I wouldn't be surprised to see him end up in coaching. This isn't a shot at Murray of course. Nothing wrong with a lockdown corner who just comes to work every day and does his job extremely well. They really compliment each other wonderfully and I doubt that happened by accident. This staff knows EXACTLY what they're looking for both in terms of size/speed, but also mental makeup.
 

Just a hunch. BBC was coming off an ACL and still had an above average year. Look for him to have a monster, all Big Ten type year. He has great instincts, speed, is quick in space and yes, he makes INTs. Like it or not, turnovers are absolutely all important.

The talk about Murray started after his breakout sophomore year, but I thought he had a bit of a letdown last year. Again, just my opinion. Feel free to draw and quarter me. He could also have a monster year. I'm surprised everyone here seems to think his game is complete at this point.
 

I think NFL scouts usually prefer consistent cover guys like murray over big play ball hawking corners like BBC. A lot like Morris Clayborne vs Tyrann Mathieu at LSU. Clayborne was a top NFL pick while Mathieu got all of the college accolades and the credit for game changing plays. With a consistent cover guy, you can depend on them effectively locking up their man on 80% or more of plays while a ball hawk may only get a PBU a handful of times in a game and an INT in only a handful of times in a season.
 



BBC is a playmaker and Murray is the the glue of the defense that's going to cover the teams best receiver each game. Every team can use both of those types of players.
 

die hard gopher said:
I think NFL scouts usually prefer consistent cover guys like murray over big play ball hawking corners like BBC. A lot like Morris Clayborne vs Tyrann Mathieu at LSU. Clayborne was a top NFL pick while Mathieu got all of the college accolades and the credit for game changing plays. With a consistent cover guy, you can depend on them effectively locking up their man on 80% or more of plays while a ball hawk may only get a PBU a handful of times in a game and an INT in only a handful of times in a season.
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Claiborne sucks now though
 



Pompous Elitist said:
I'm surprised everyone here seems to think his game is complete at this point.
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That statement is not accurate. Be careful when dealing with absolutes.

However, you failed to inform us what is incomplete about "his game". I'm interested to hear you opinion.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Just a hunch. BBC was coming off an ACL and still had an above average year. Look for him to have a monster, all Big Ten type year. He has great instincts, speed, is quick in space and yes, he makes INTs. Like it or not, turnovers are absolutely all important.

The talk about Murray started after his breakout sophomore year, but I thought he had a bit of a letdown last year. Again, just my opinion. Feel free to draw and quarter me. He could also have a monster year. I'm surprised everyone here seems to think his game is complete at this point.
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I'm with you 100%. Murray got beat more than people think last year. There were a number of times when WRs were open and made plays, I looked to see who was covering them, and was surprised to see it was Murray. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Murray is bad, he is very solid. But after reading posts on this board, you'd think the Gophers had Darrell Revis over there.
 

Unregistered User said:
That statement is not accurate. Be careful when dealing with absolutes.

However, you failed to inform us what is incomplete about "his game". I'm interested to hear you opinion.
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As another astutely noticed, he was beaten more last year. There were a few games they were working on him quite a bit. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he's a bad player, just that he wasn't as great this past season, in my lowly opinion.

He might play more man vs zone than BBC does, I don't know the breakdown on number of plays but that's the usual reason given for his lack of big plays. I realize Sawvel coaches it this way, but it's also a fact there are times when it would be appropriate to track the ball. Feel free to disagree, it's a philosophy thing.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
As another astutely noticed, he was beaten more last year. There were a few games they were working on him quite a bit. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he's a bad player, just that he wasn't as great this past season, in my lowly opinion.

He might play more man vs zone than BBC does, I don't know the breakdown on number of plays but that's the usual reason given for his lack of big plays. I realize Sawvel coaches it this way, but it's also a fact there are times when it would be appropriate to track the ball. Feel free to disagree, it's a philosophy thing.
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Nah...I'm cool with that. Never was trying to start a pissing match. I like the way they're coached, it's part of the defensive philosophy, and every player, no matter how good, gets beat sometimes.
 

die hard gopher said:
I think NFL scouts usually prefer consistent cover guys like murray over big play ball hawking corners like BBC. A lot like Morris Clayborne vs Tyrann Mathieu at LSU. Clayborne was a top NFL pick while Mathieu got all of the college accolades and the credit for game changing plays. With a consistent cover guy, you can depend on them effectively locking up their man on 80% or more of plays while a ball hawk may only get a PBU a handful of times in a game and an INT in only a handful of times in a season.
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I'm not sure i agree with you. It's true they play more man than in the past but it's on a team by team basis. Ideally id want someone that can play both, can run and possesses superior ball skills. Then again, I don't watch much NFL so maybe things have changed dramatically since 2010. I quit the NFL after the
Superdome disaster. Oh Favre.
 

Athlons: Who are the best NFL prospects to watch in the Big Ten in 2015?

17. Theiren Cockran, DE, Minnesota (6-6, 257)

He’s rangy and versatile. He can play outside backer in a 3-4 but has excelled as a true end for Jerry Kill. Should the Florida native blossom into an All-Big Ten player, his stock could soar come draft day.

21. Eric Murray, CB, Minnesota (6-0, 196)

Murray is an incredibly productive cornerback for the Gophers. He totaled 69 tackles last fall for a team one half of football away from winning its division. All Minnesota players are well-coached and he could be the best player on the team in ’15.

http://athlonsports.com/college-football/top-25-big-ten-2016-nfl-draft-prospects-watch

Go Gophers!!
 

BleedGopher said:
Athlons: Who are the best NFL prospects to watch in the Big Ten in 2015?

17. Theiren Cockran, DE, Minnesota (6-6, 257)

He’s rangy and versatile. He can play outside backer in a 3-4 but has excelled as a true end for Jerry Kill. Should the Florida native blossom into an All-Big Ten player, his stock could soar come draft day.

21. Eric Murray, CB, Minnesota (6-0, 196)

Murray is an incredibly productive cornerback for the Gophers. He totaled 69 tackles last fall for a team one half of football away from winning its division. All Minnesota players are well-coached and he could be the best player on the team in ’15.

http://athlonsports.com/college-football/top-25-big-ten-2016-nfl-draft-prospects-watch

Go Gophers!!
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I really don't get the Cockran love. He is built like an NFL player but I don't feel like he has played like one to this point in his Gopher career. In terms of the DL last year it was the interior guys that stood out, not the ends. I am not saying he is a bad player, he's solid, but I also don't think he has been an impact defensive end to this point. Agree with the comment that in the NFL he is an outside LB in a 3-4.
 

MNVCGUY said:
I really don't get the Cockran love. He is built like an NFL player but I don't feel like he has played like one to this point in his Gopher career. In terms of the DL last year it was the interior guys that stood out, not the ends. I am not saying he is a bad player, he's solid, but I also don't think he has been an impact defensive end to this point. Agree with the comment that in the NFL he is an outside LB in a 3-4.
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He has been selected as either a Big Ten honorable mention or second team All Big Ten by both the media and coaches for two consecutive years. Cedric was neither of those by the coaches nor media in any year. Theiren was a terror when Ra'Shede was with him so hopefully an improved interior with more depth can get rid of some the the double teams that he faced last year.
 

die hard gopher said:
He has been selected as either a Big Ten honorable mention or second team All Big Ten by both the media and coaches for two consecutive years. Cedric was neither of those by the coaches nor media in any year. Theiren was a terror when Ra'Shede was with him so hopefully an improved interior with more depth can get rid of some the the double teams that he faced last year.
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He was definitely more impressive as a Sophomore then he was as a Junior. As I said he's a good player but when I think of defensive ends that have played here (even narrowing the focus to the past 20-25 years) I don't know that Cockran would be real high on that list. Looking at it another way, when we are looking at 2016 and discussing who is going to replace guys that graduate, I think there will be a lot of concern about how who is going to replace BBC and Murray but right now I don't think there will be much worry about replacing Cockran because I just don't see him as that kind of difference maker.

Hopefully he has a great season and vaults to the top of the list of guys that will be tough to replace.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
As another astutely noticed, he was beaten more last year. There were a few games they were working on him quite a bit. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he's a bad player, just that he wasn't as great this past season, in my lowly opinion.

He might play more man vs zone than BBC does, I don't know the breakdown on number of plays but that's the usual reason given for his lack of big plays. I realize Sawvel coaches it this way, but it's also a fact there are times when it would be appropriate to track the ball. Feel free to disagree, it's a philosophy thing.
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Disagree. He gave up a little bit more last year than the year before but our pass rush took a dive last year too. He was still quite possibly the best cover CB in the conference last year. And I'm so sick of the 'play the ball conversation' that has little relevance to this conversation anyway. Bottom line is most of the balls caught on Murray were plays with excellent offensive execution. He was very rarely just straight up beat. And we're nit picking anyway. The kid is one of the best CBs in CFB
 

Ok.

Not sure why this is taken as a put down of Murray. BBC is pretty darn good as well.

This is a good argument to have! When was the last time it could be argued we have the best cb duo in the big 10?
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Ok.

Not sure why this is taken as a put down of Murray. BBC is pretty darn good as well.

This is a good argument to have! When is the last time it could be argued we have the best cb duo in the big 10.
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I would feel comfortable stacking those two up against pretty much and CB duo in the country, not just the Big 10. Imagine how great they could be if we had a defensive line that could consistently get to the QB and make him really uncomfortable.
 

MNVCGUY said:
I would feel comfortable stacking those two up against pretty much and CB duo in the country, not just the Big 10. Imagine how great they could be if we had a defensive line that could consistently get to the QB and make him really uncomfortable.
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We will soon. I hope that our next string of dbs can be as dominant.
 

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