Expansion teams for BIG Hockey Conference?

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beat bucky

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Anyone have any thoughts on possible expansion teams for BIG Hockey? Title 9 aside, it's obvious that six teams hardly makes a conference, especially when one of them just started a program.
Two more teams would be ideal, I think.
My choices would be a geographically close Iowa, who already has an AHL and some USHL franchises, and Northwestern or Illinois, who could provide Blackhawks fans and would give you the Chicago TV market. A lesser possibility would be country cousins Nebraska with NCHC and USHL hockey doing well there.
 

Best guess would be Illinois, as they have a decent club program (similar to Penn State before Pegula dumped loads of money on them to move to D1). Outside of that, Iowa would be probably good, though they don't have a history of hockey (Iowa State, however, has a very successful club team - proving it can be possible).

The Blackhawks owner is a Northwestern alum, so there's definite possibility there if he pulled a Penn State - but the student body is so small and athletics in general - outside of the commitment they've made to build their new training/student athlete facility - is generally underfunded relative to other schools, so it might be tough outside of the big donation.

Nebraska is tough for me, Omaha is already very successful at the D1 level and I struggle to see the university system choosing to support two D1 hockey programs in a state with little homegrown talent.

Frankly, Maryland would not be a terrible bet given the Under Armour money, but hockey's an area where they (UA) don't have a big presence so it's hard to imagine they'd choose to invest without it. Rutgers might be another one, given it's east coast and NYC is lacking a college hockey team, but they almost certainly don't have the money to throw down and get a real program going.

If I were a betting man, my money would go to Illinois first and Iowa second.
 

It might be more likely to see our next addition be a non-Big Ten team. I heard some speculation about B1G being a potential landing spot for ASU when they go full D1, but it sounds like the WCHA and NCHC have been courting them pretty well and they make more geographic sense.
 

I've heard that part of ASU's reasoning for going D1 is to influence other PAC10 schools to start up a program, in hopes of creating PAC10 Hockey within the decade.
 

Why can't UND joint the B10 just for hockey? Notre Dame plays-in with some conferences in odd sports.

Too bad you can't just rename UNO to Lincoln.
 



I think NoDak might be a good member. Just like Notre Dame floats around.

NoDak out draws most Big Ten teams, so it's no like they'd be stealing hockey revenue.

Our strength-of-schedule is killing us.
 

Studwell55 said:
I think NoDak might be a good member. Just like Notre Dame floats around.

NoDak out draws most Big Ten teams, so it's no like they'd be stealing hockey revenue.

Our strength-of-schedule is killing us.
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Our record is hurting us a lot more than our strength of schedule. We like to imagine the issue is that we have been lighting it up and our being held back in the 13th spot in PWR because of the weak B1G. The fact of the matter is, despite playing in the weak B1G, we still only have the 12th best winning percentage in the county.
 

Studwell55 said:
I think NoDak might be a good member. Just like Notre Dame floats around.

NoDak out draws most Big Ten teams, so it's no like they'd be stealing hockey revenue.

Our strength-of-schedule is killing us.
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The Big Ten conference still has a huge boner for member schools being part of the AAU. That's why Johns Hopkins being an associate member for lacrosse is not terribly surprising. I'd be shocked if the conference even considered adding a school like NoDak, given that it's really not even close to AAU-status.
 



Studwell55 said:
I think NoDak might be a good member. Just like Notre Dame floats around.

NoDak out draws most Big Ten teams, so it's no like they'd be stealing hockey revenue.

Our strength-of-schedule is killing us.
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I'd love to have them join but don't think they'd leave the premier hockey conference for a rinky dink 6 team league.
 


I don't think you can call a conference with Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin rinky-dink, with close to 20 NCAA hockey championships among them. The issue is more teams. Illinois and Iowa, with their resources, would both be competitive almost immediately. Heck, look at Penn State. Two years in and they're close to a middle of the pack program in the BIG and would be in the NCHC. Just need a couple of good, geographically sensible markets to boost interest and revenue.
 

beat bucky said:
I don't think you can call a conference with Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin rinky-dink, with close to 20 NCAA hockey championships among them. The issue is more teams. Illinois and Iowa, with their resources, would both be competitive almost immediately. Heck, look at Penn State. Two years in and they're close to a middle of the pack program in the BIG and would be in the NCHC. Just need a couple of good, geographically sensible markets to boost interest and revenue.
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Calling it rinky dink may be a bit harsh but I'm still very bitter over leaving the WCHA. I haven't quite reached the acceptance stage yet.

I have to disagree with you about Iowa adding hockey. I grew up in northern Iowa and the sport barely exists down there. I just don't see them adding hockey any time soon.
 



Ron Johnson Super Fan said:
Calling it rinky dink may be a bit harsh but I'm still very bitter over leaving the WCHA. I haven't quite reached the acceptance stage yet.

I have to disagree with you about Iowa adding hockey. I grew up in northern Iowa and the sport barely exists down there. I just don't see them adding hockey any time soon.
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Yet there USHL teams are thriving?
 


Having a minor league team is one thing and a successful D1 hockey program another. I just don't see the University of Iowa spending the amount of money and resources it would take to start a hockey program. I hope I'm wrong as I would like to see the conference expand with successful programs but I would be willing to bet large amounts of money that Iowa won't be fielding a D1 hockey team in the next twenty years.
 

Ron Johnson Super Fan said:
Having a minor league team is one thing and a successful D1 hockey program another. I just don't see the University of Iowa spending the amount of money and resources it would take to start a hockey program. I hope I'm wrong as I would like to see the conference expand with successful programs but I would be willing to bet large amounts of money that Iowa won't be fielding a D1 hockey team in the next twenty years.
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USHSL is not minor league hockey. It is junior hockey. (Best league for recruiting in the US). Penn State's program is a money maker in year 3.

We hate Ioaw would sound great in Mariucci...
 

It is embarrassing to lose to Iowa in anything but I cannot imagine losing to them in hockey.
 

Mvgopher said:
USHSL is not minor league hockey. It is junior hockey. (Best league for recruiting in the US). Penn State's program is a money maker in year 3.

We hate Ioaw would sound great in Mariucci...
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I understand its not technically minor league hockey, but that's not really even relevant to my point. Just because its USHL franchises are successful doesn't mean they'd be able to support a D1 program in Iowa City. Penn State has been successful to this point but they have a couple of advantages that Iowa doesn't have. They received a gigantic donation from the Pegulas to get themselves up and running and Pennsylvania has a much stronger hockey culture than Iowa.

I agree it would be great to play Iowa if they could field a team. I just don't think it will happen.
 

Adding teams is a must in order for this league to evolve into something great.

I think that Illinois and Northwestern are the most likely to field a team, and would be great additions. As some have already mentioned, illinois has a great club team that has won a recent national championship, and Northwestern makes sense being in chicago, with a great hockey fan base already.

I feel like Rutgers, Maryland, and maybe even purdue could also do it. I dont know any of the particulars but that is just what makes sense in my head. Not sure how the whole title IX would affect all this. Seems likely to be a drawback for some.
We need teams though. it would make it a lot more fun.
 

The Big 10 needs to add a quality respected program. Illinois is "down state " and definitely not in an area with any hockey tradition. Having a good club team is one thing. A Division 1 program another thing. Iowa State has a very popular club team but I don't think we'll ever see a D1 hockey program at Iowa State. I skeptical about ASU. I think it would take them a long time to build a program.
I think the best thing for the Big 10 would be to add a team that plays hockey at the D 1 level but not other sports. North Dakota is such a school but it has been said they are not an AAU school. What about UMD, St. Cloud, Minnesota State or a number of other schools where hockey is the only D1 sport. I think it would be the easiest way to improve the status of Big 10 hockey.
The NCHC placed 6 teams in the playoffs this year. That's pretty damn impressive ! They have to be considered the top conference in college hockey right now.
 

north45 said:
The NCHC placed 6 teams in the playoffs this year. That's pretty damn impressive ! They have to be considered the top conference in college hockey right now.
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It sucks that we leave and somehow they get better.
 


t-docious said:
Adding teams is a must in order for this league to evolve into something great.

I think that Illinois and Northwestern are the most likely to field a team, and would be great additions. As some have already mentioned, illinois has a great club team that has won a recent national championship, and Northwestern makes sense being in chicago, with a great hockey fan base already.

I feel like Rutgers, Maryland, and maybe even purdue could also do it. I dont know any of the particulars but that is just what makes sense in my head. Not sure how the whole title IX would affect all this. Seems likely to be a drawback for some.
We need teams though. it would make it a lot more fun.
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I just don't see NW. Their facilities are already pretty poor. They'd have to build a new arena. Their only hope would be for someone to make a huge donation similar to what happened at Penn St.
 

MinneStoa said:
I'd imagine it has something to do with basically being able to cherry-pick the best teams from the WCHA and the CCHA.
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I was actually impressed with how strong the WCHA was this year considering that they were the leftovers the NCHC didn't want from the old WCHA and CCHA.
 

MinneStoa said:
I'd imagine it has something to do with basically being able to cherry-pick the best teams from the WCHA and the CCHA.
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Yep. NoDak, UMD, St Cloud and Denver were typical playoff qualifiers from the old WCHA (three out the four of those teams have made the tournament every year since 2008), while Miami has been a virtual lock (missing last season, but qualifying the seven years prior to that). Really, Omaha is the only major surprise out of those six teams.

Really, it's a combination of a great year for those teams and a bad year collectively for B1G teams. Michigan is down, but made 22 straight tournaments before missing in 2012/13 (when they were still part of the CCHA). In the last ten years, they've made seven of 10 tournaments (missing three straight).

Wisconsin is hit-or-miss typically, having made six of the last 10 tournaments, while Michigan State is slightly behind, making four of the last 10. The Gophers are more consistent, having made seven out of the last 10 tournaments (they had a similar three-straight-misses streak as Michigan a few years ago, as we all painfully remember).

I would say in a typical year, based on recent history, we could expect two of the six current B1G teams to qualify (most often Michigan and Minnesota, but in other years a combination of one of those plus Wisconsin or Michigan State). In a good year, three, and in a bad year, one. This is a bad year and likely - given history - not some indication of a "new normal." The normal is probably better than what we witnessed this year. Of course, trends start somewhere, so we can't say with any certainty that it isn't the beginning of the end.

That's not to say the league wouldn't benefit greatly from having another "consistent" qualifier in the sense of Michigan or Minnesota. The hope would be that Penn State could become that - and they're improving as a program, so the potential is there. Of course, it will take time, time that the league may not have before perceptual damage becomes something more permanent. Beyond that, it would take adding a team (or two) willing to pour in big bucks to facilities/coaching/etc. to catch up. We'll see if it happens.
 

GophersInIowa said:
I just don't see NW. Their facilities are already pretty poor. They'd have to build a new arena. Their only hope would be for someone to make a huge donation similar to what happened at Penn St.
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The Blackhawks owner (Wirtz) is a NW alum, that would be the only major hope (Pegula, who built PSU's program, is the Sabres owner). Of course, Wirtz is worth far less than Pegula ($500m vs $4.6b, according to Wikipedia) so the likelihood of it happening is much, much smaller. But if he wanted to rally some billionaire friends and push to get college hockey in the Chicago area, I don't doubt he could get the process started.
 

Gopher07 said:
Yep. NoDak, UMD, St Cloud and Denver were typical playoff qualifiers from the old WCHA (three out the four of those teams have made the tournament every year since 2008), while Miami has been a virtual lock (missing last season, but qualifying the seven years prior to that). Really, Omaha is the only major surprise out of those six teams.

Really, it's a combination of a great year for those teams and a bad year collectively for B1G teams. Michigan is down, but made 22 straight tournaments before missing in 2012/13 (when they were still part of the CCHA). In the last ten years, they've made seven of 10 tournaments (missing three straight).

Wisconsin is hit-or-miss typically, having made six of the last 10 tournaments, while Michigan State is slightly behind, making four of the last 10. The Gophers are more consistent, having made seven out of the last 10 tournaments (they had a similar three-straight-misses streak as Michigan a few years ago, as we all painfully remember).

I would say in a typical year, based on recent history, we could expect two of the six current B1G teams to qualify (most often Michigan and Minnesota, but in other years a combination of one of those plus Wisconsin or Michigan State). In a good year, three, and in a bad year, one. This is a bad year and likely - given history - not some indication of a "new normal." The normal is probably better than what we witnessed this year. Of course, trends start somewhere, so we can't say with any certainty that it isn't the beginning of the end.

That's not to say the league wouldn't benefit greatly from having another "consistent" qualifier in the sense of Michigan or Minnesota. The hope would be that Penn State could become that - and they're improving as a program, so the potential is there. Of course, it will take time, time that the league may not have before perceptual damage becomes something more permanent. Beyond that, it would take adding a team (or two) willing to pour in big bucks to facilities/coaching/etc. to catch up. We'll see if it happens.
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Good analysis. I also think within the next 5 years, we see a year when all of the teams have an "up year", and we start complaining about how tough it is to be stuck in a small conference with so many good teams that you never get an easy weekend.
 

People in Iowa City will support anything that has a "hawkeye" on it. That's why M*A*S*H was the hottest tv show there. Anyway, what else is there to do in that one bird town?
 

Mvgopher said:
USHSL is not minor league hockey. It is junior hockey. (Best league for recruiting in the US). Penn State's program is a money maker in year 3.

We hate Ioaw would sound great in Mariucci...
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I would think the USHL success in the state of Iowa would help a school like Iowa if they started hockey. Since a good chunk of USHL players end up playing college hockey, the players would be known in the state.
 

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