Why does everyone write off Joey King?

Donate To GopherHole
scher215 said:
I never said Joey was as good as Dekker. Dekker is, however, much less strong/athletic than guys like Julius Randle and Trevor Mbakwe and is much more perimeter oriented. He started at the 4 for a final four team.

I am pretty sure Joey has used post moves multiple times and scored. It's not like wide open 3's are his only points. He has shown (against Wisconsin no less) he can post up and score on the block.

And If you think Joey is only 6-7, I've got bad news about Josh Martin for you- Martin has said Joey was taller than him when he visited. King measures 6-9.

PS, as another poster mentioned, he was a sophomore in his first year in the Big 10 this year.
Click to expand...

Dekker is smaller than Joey, but is a much better rebounder and defender.
 

scher215 said:
And If you think Joey is only 6-7, I've got bad news about Josh Martin for you- Martin has said Joey was taller than him when he visited. King measures 6-9.
Click to expand...

Where is this quote from Martin?

Didn't Martin say he grew 2" over this season? So not bad news at all.
 

Height is overrated. Overhead reach and vertical are much more important for finishing around the basket and rebounding. Although I don't know for sure, I'm willing to bet Martin has a longer wingspan and overhead reach than King and can certainly jump higher.
 




katze019 said:
Congratulations you are the winner of GH 'Moron of the Day' award.
Click to expand...

ironic that you call me a moron without actually using your brilliance to take a stance and defend it. Any 2nd grader can call someone stupid, so I guess bravo on showing the conversation skills of an 8 year old
 


DeathClutch said:
Dekker is smaller than Joey, but is a much better rebounder and defender.
Click to expand...

Again, not saying I disagree. People just act like unless Trevor Mbakwe is your PF your team simply won't win.

There is no reason what so ever Joey can't work hard and improve his defense/rebounding to a level where it really helps the team.

I'm annoyed with people saying, well he doesn't have a 40" vertical and he isn't an athletic freak. Therefore he sucks and shouldn't be on our team. Maybe he can play 5 minutes per game or something.
 

scher215 said:
I never said Joey was as good as Dekker. Dekker is, however, much less strong/athletic than guys like Julius Randle and Trevor Mbakwe and is much more perimeter oriented. He started at the 4 for a final four team.

I am pretty sure Joey has used post moves multiple times and scored. It's not like wide open 3's are his only points. He has shown (against Wisconsin no less) he can post up and score on the block.

And If you think Joey is only 6-7, I've got bad news about Josh Martin for you- Martin has said Joey was taller than him when he visited. King measures 6-9.

PS, as another poster mentioned, he was a sophomore in his first year in the Big 10 this year.
Click to expand...

I wasn't responding to your post but to the post saying King is a better shooter. And yes King has shown the ability to score from the post when he gets a favorable matchup. Smart on his part but he does that maybe once per game because generally the matchup isn't favorable for him. And yes he's listed at 6'9" but he's not a very long 6'9". For instance Mbakwe was probably about 6'6" but had such long arms (and leaping ability) that he was able to play like a 6'10" post. So at 6'9" King has short arms and little vertical bounce. My guess is Martin will play bigger than King (long and has bounce). Anyway the point here isn't to claim King sucks, its to be clear that he is who he is and that he has certain strengths and weaknesses. He's obviously good enough to be a contributor on a good team but we definitely need an upgrade in talent at that spot if we want to do any real damage next year
 



oleboy41 said:
without actually using your brilliance to take a stance and defend it
Click to expand...

“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

Moron of the day... that was being nice considering how idiotic your post was.
 

oleboy41 said:
He's obviously good enough to be a contributor on a good team but we definitely need an upgrade in talent at that spot if we want to do any real damage next year
Click to expand...

I don't think we can upgrade more than we might have already with Martin. I'm not sure there is much left for us. Best to rely on who we have given we wont get a 1 and done.

Winasota Gopher said:
Debatable. However, this is approaching the conversation about the tallest short guy.
Click to expand...
You're exactly right lets take things a step farther. Everyone is right at Joey's size as long as he adds 5-10lbs this summer. Only Vonleh is taller.

Starting Power forwards in the Big Ten
Joey King, UM, PF, 6'9", 225lbs
Sam Dekker, UW, PF, 6'7", 220lbs
Branden Dawson, MSU, PF, 6'6", 225lbs
LaQuinton Ross, OSU, 6'8", 220lbs
David Rivers, Neb, 6'7", 198lbs
Aaron White, Iowa, 6'9", 220lbs
Glenn Robinson III, UMich, 6'6", 220lbs
Noah Vonleh, Ind, 6'10", 240lbs
Jon Ekey, Ill, 6'7", 225lbs
Brandon Taylor, PSU, 6'7" 235lbs
Northwestern, Someone between 6'5"-6'7"
Purdue, Someone about 6'6" not sure who was their normal starter at PF.


Other notable PF
Julius Randle, UK 6'9", 250lbs
Jabari Parker, Duke, 6'8" 225lbs
Perry Ellis, KU, 6'8", 220lbs
Deandre Daniels, UConn, 6'9" 220lbs
Will Yegette, UF, 6'8" 235lbs

Also I suspect King will be better than Purdue, NW, Ekey, and rivers next year. And right with Taylor, Indiana, OSU, mich(If robinson goes pro) next year. Team names replaced player names when I was unsure who will start.

Edit: POLLYANNA!!!
 

oleboy41 said:
I wasn't responding to your post but to the post saying King is a better shooter. And yes King has shown the ability to score from the post when he gets a favorable matchup. Smart on his part but he does that maybe once per game because generally the matchup isn't favorable for him. And yes he's listed at 6'9" but he's not a very long 6'9". For instance Mbakwe was probably about 6'6" but had such long arms (and leaping ability) that he was able to play like a 6'10" post. So at 6'9" King has short arms and little vertical bounce. My guess is Martin will play bigger than King (long and has bounce). Anyway the point here isn't to claim King sucks, its to be clear that he is who he is and that he has certain strengths and weaknesses. He's obviously good enough to be a contributor on a good team but we definitely need an upgrade in talent at that spot if we want to do any real damage next year
Click to expand...
I don't see any evidence that Joey King has short arms. He's getting pushed around when rebounding, it's not his length or vertical. He's altered many shots with his length and is also smart enough and has enough lateral quickness to take charges. He's not Mbakwe, but he's definitely not out of place in the Big Ten. It's no mistake that he started over more athletic guys like Buggs.

To confirm your point about Mbakwe at the NBA combine he measured 6'6.75'' with a 7'4" wingspan and 8'10.5'' reach. Cody Zeller was 6' 10.75'' with a 6'10.75'' wingspan and 8'10' reach.
 

jaymil said:
Height is overrated. Overhead reach and vertical are much more important for finishing around the basket and rebounding. Although I don't know for sure, I'm willing to bet Martin has a longer wingspan and overhead reach than King and can certainly jump higher.
Click to expand...

On defense if you jump it seems like an automatic foul now, so I wouldn't say height is overrated in that aspect. And all of this talk about King not being able to create his own shot is BS. Does moving without the ball in order to get an open shot not count? It's not like defenses leave him wide open on purpose, he finds a way to score.

Martin and King are almost completely different players from what I've heard, so its kind of hard to compare them.
 



If you take out the top 4 or so newcomers in the Big Ten (Petteway, Lil Dre, Rice and Vonaleh), I'd say King fits into the next tier of newcomers with the biggest impact on their teams. I realize there are several factors that play into that, but King did a really nice job in his first year with the team. I don't understand some of the negativity towards King.
 

Tim1406 said:
I don't think we can upgrade more than we might have already with Martin. I'm not sure there is much left for us. Best to rely on who we have given we wont get a 1 and done.


You're exactly right lets take things a step farther. Everyone is right at Joey's size as long as he adds 5-10lbs this summer. Only Vonleh is taller.

Starting Power forwards in the Big Ten
Joey King, UM, PF, 6'9", 225lbs
Sam Dekker, UW, PF, 6'7", 220lbs
Branden Dawson, MSU, PF, 6'6", 225lbs
LaQuinton Ross, OSU, 6'8", 220lbs
David Rivers, Neb, 6'7", 198lbs
Aaron White, Iowa, 6'9", 220lbs
Glenn Robinson III, UMich, 6'6", 220lbs
Noah Vonleh, Ind, 6'10", 240lbs
Jon Ekey, Ill, 6'7", 225lbs
Brandon Taylor, PSU, 6'7" 235lbs
Northwestern, Someone between 6'5"-6'7"
Purdue, Someone about 6'6" not sure who was their normal starter at PF.


Other notable PF
Julius Randle, UK 6'9", 250lbs
Jabari Parker, Duke, 6'8" 225lbs
Perry Ellis, KU, 6'8", 220lbs
Deandre Daniels, UConn, 6'9" 220lbs
Will Yegette, UF, 6'8" 235lbs

Also I suspect King will be better than Purdue, NW, Ekey, and rivers next year. And right with Taylor, Indiana, OSU, mich(If robinson goes pro) next year. Team names replaced player names when I was unsure who will start.

Edit: POLLYANNA!!!
Click to expand...

And Joey is a lesser rebounder than every player on that list. Joey averaged 4.8rb/40. Height does not mean a whole lot when it comes to rebounding.
 

katze019 said:
“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
Click to expand...

I'm not silly enough to call you an idiot since I don't know you but good advice. FYI you still haven't made any statement other than calling me a name, lol
 

AO54 said:
I don't see any evidence that Joey King has short arms. He's getting pushed around when rebounding, it's not his length or vertical. He's altered many shots with his length and is also smart enough and has enough lateral quickness to take charges. He's not Mbakwe, but he's definitely not out of place in the Big Ten. It's no mistake that he started over more athletic guys like Buggs.

To confirm your point about Mbakwe at the NBA combine he measured 6'6.75'' with a 7'4" wingspan and 8'10.5'' reach. Cody Zeller was 6' 10.75'' with a 6'10.75'' wingspan and 8'10' reach.
Click to expand...

I don't have measurements but one of the first things I thought when I first saw King this year was that his arms looked short. I'm weird like that though
 

DeathClutch said:
Height does not mean a whole lot when it comes to rebounding.
Click to expand...

That explains why every player in the top 10 for rebounding in the Big Ten is 6'5" or taller, and why 7 of those 10 were 6'9" or taller.
 

dpodoll68 said:
That explains why every player in the top 10 for rebounding in the Big Ten is 6'5" or taller, and why 7 of those 10 were 6'9" or taller.
Click to expand...

Obviously it matters somewhat, but it doesn't explain why Joey is one of the taller starting 4's but is not a good rebounder. Things like positioning, jumping ability and length are just as important as height.
 

Short arms
Not really 6'-9"
Slow on D
Slow Release
Cannot create his own shot
Lacks strength
Poor dribbler
Can’t jump
No athleticism
Can shoot, but only if WIDE open
Not a B1G PF
Big noggin
Small frame
Twig legs

What else am I missing?

For all those deficiencies it has to be a miracle what he was able to do on the court this season. A modern day "Rudy" Ruettiger!
 

katze019 said:
Short arms
Not really 6'-9"
Slow on D
Slow Release
Cannot create his own shot
Lacks strength
Poor dribbler
Can’t jump/no athleticism
Can shoot, but only if WIDE open
Not a B1G PF

What else am I missing?

For all those deficiencies it has to be a miracle what he was able to do on the court this season. A modern day "Rudy" Ruettiger!
Click to expand...

Are post moves or moving without the ball considered creating your own shot? You don't just score double digit points in the Big Ten by defenses leaving you wide open.
 

I'm big on Joey King.
Solid Sophmore campaign, made a smooth transition from MVC to the Big 10.
Will only get better, played very good ball in the NIT.
Good shooting %, Good defender. I expect improvement from him next year and as a senior.
Probably be a starter this upcoming season, definitely be one his senior season.
 

Jigga said:
I'm big on Joey King.
Solid Sophmore campaign, made a smooth transition from MVC to the Big 10.
Will only get better, played very good ball in the NIT.
Good shooting %, Good defender. I expect improvement from him next year and as a senior.
Probably be a starter this upcoming season, definitely be one his senior season.
Click to expand...

I, too, like Joey King. He is now the hardest worker on the team with Austin leaving. That being said, Joey King is not a good defender...especially off the ball. He gets caught watching and not anticipating quite often. He struggles to fight through picks. In short, he's got a lot of work to do on the defensive end. Still...I do like Joey and expect that by the time he's a senior he will be a very solid player for us.
 

tinyarch said:
I, too, like Joey King. He is now the hardest worker on the team with Austin leaving. That being said, Joey King is not a good defender...especially off the ball. He gets caught watching and not anticipating quite often. He struggles to fight through picks. In short, he's got a lot of work to do on the defensive end. Still...I do like Joey and expect that by the time he's a senior he will be a very solid player for us.
Click to expand...

OK. let me say potential to be a good defender with his size, speed, lateral movement and I expect him to improve in that aspect also.
I was mainly speaking of his on ball defense and versatility to gaurd a couple different positions.
 

Jigga said:
OK. let me say potential to be a good defender with his size, speed, lateral movement and I expect him to improve in that aspect also.
I was mainly speaking of his on ball defense and versatility to gaurd a couple different positions.
Click to expand...

Not sure is serious.
 

How many games would we have lost without King? Definitely a few!

Joey King was a solid Sophmore performer and won a few games for us. We would have had a bigger bench issue against Florida State if we didn't have his five fouls. He will improve his size, vertical and athleticism as long as he is coached by Pitino.

Also he has a great confidence that you cannot beat. He wants the ball in his hands when it matters and he was never afraid to take the shot. We need to keep this thread for the haters to see what they wrote when he is done with his career. He was a critical pickup last year for this team and will be a solid contributor. Not every team gets a Julius Randle.
 

Big Ten Championship said:
Joey King was a solid Sophmore performer and won a few games for us. We would have had a bigger bench issue against Florida State if we didn't have his five fouls. He will improve his size, vertical and athleticism as long as he is coached by Pitino.

Also he has a great confidence that you cannot beat. He wants the ball in his hands when it matters and he was never afraid to take the shot. We need to keep this thread for the haters to see what they wrote when he is done with his career. He was a critical pickup last year for this team and will be a solid contributor. Not every team gets a Julius Randle.
Click to expand...

I agree that he is a solid contributor but why should we strive for solid? Is Pitino a hater because he was trying to recruit over Joey? Guys like Reid, Anthony Lee, and MJ Rhett would all start over Joey. It's not hating when you are being realistic about the abilities of a certain player.
 

DeathClutch said:
I agree that he is a solid contributor but why should we strive for solid? Is Pitino a hater because he was trying to recruit over Joey? Guys like Reid, Anthony Lee, and MJ Rhett would all start over Joey. It's not hating when you are being realistic about the abilities of a certain player.
Click to expand...

And no player has ever improved in his time at school. Ever. In the history of athletics.
 


AO54 said:
Joey is a better shooter. If you judged him solely based upon his trip to the barn this year when he scored 20 you might think he did that regularly but he didn't manage 20 again and ended the season below 33% from 3 and below 70% from the free throw line.
Click to expand...

He scored double digits in 13 regular season conference games. Joey King did it once......

You act like 20 points a game in the big ten is expected of a good player. The highest scoring average in the conference is typically 17-18 ppg.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom