Division alignments

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Just saw on spotscenter that Minnesota would be pared with the Michigan schools, Iowa and Penn State among others; and wisconsin would be with Nebraska, Ohio State and others in the other division. Obviously this is not geographically driven. I will look for a link, and if this is true how do you all feel about not being with wisconsin in the same division?
 

I don't think that will happen. Unless they guarantee an annual meeting and Whisky isn't rotated like the other programs we'll play however it's split up.
 

Jim Delaney said there has been no discussion on alignment and that the Presidents have indicated they want to oversee that process. Not too mention the likely addition of more teams.
 


The only alignment that makes any sense (considering the current crop of teams) is Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin, Northwestern, and Illinois in the west and the rest in the east.

Anything else would be entirely idiotic.
 


13 Lined Ground Squirrel said:
The only alignment that makes any sense (considering the current crop of teams) is Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin, Northwestern, and Illinois in the west and the rest in the east.

Anything else would be entirely idiotic.
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This.

An East/West alignment is not as competitively unbalanced as people think. Sure the "sexier" names (OSU, Michigan, PSU) are all in the east but Iowa/Wisconsin/Nebraska are certainly no slouches.
 

The divisions that most make sense geographically is obviously West: Neb, Minn, Iowa, Wisc, Illinois, NW. East:OSU, Mich, Mich St. PSU, Pur, Ind.

But I highly doubt they would put the bulk of the superpowers in one division.

This is just my opinion but I think the divisions should be West: Neb, Minn, Iowa, Wisc, Mich, Mich St. East:OSU, PSU, Pur, Ind, Illinois, NW.

That way it would be a little more balanced and we could maintain our better rivalries. However I think there is no way that they don't continue to play the Mich-OSU game every year. Much like how the ACC has FSU and Miami in separate divisions, but still has them play every year.

Thoughts?
 

the huskie gopher said:
The divisions that most make sense geographically is obviously West: Neb, Minn, Iowa, Wisc, Illinois, NW. East:OSU, Mich, Mich St. PSU, Pur, Ind.

But I highly doubt they would put the bulk of the superpowers in one division.

This is just my opinion but I think the divisions should be West: Neb, Minn, Iowa, Wisc, Mich, Mich St. East:OSU, PSU, Pur, Ind, Illinois, NW.

That way it would be a little more balanced and we could maintain our better rivalries. However I think there is no way that they don't continue to play the Mich-OSU game every year. Much like how the ACC has FSU and Miami in separate divisions, but still has them play every year.

Thoughts?
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Thoughts? You're trying too hard and not actually thinking hard enough. List the top 6 teams in the last 20 years that are now part of the Big Ten.

1/2 are Ohio State and Nebraska however you want to order them.

3 is Michigan.

Before you say PSU is #4 stop and do a quick check, since coming to the Big Ten PSU has won or shared 3 Big Ten Titles, the same as Wisconsin and 1 more than Iowa.

Also, Northwestern has actually won or tied for 3 Big Ten Titles since PSU arrived and Illinois has played in two BCS Bowls.

East/West isn't as unbalanced as most people would probably expect. The East maybe has a little more fire power at the top but the West holds its own and actually has more depth than the East (Indiana is by far the weakest program in the conference).
 

my only problem with the east west thing is the population balance. Forgive me for being a bit paranoid after all this conference destruction crap, but it just doesn't seem like a good idea putting the majority of the population in the one half.
 



grunkiejr said:
Thoughts? You're trying too hard and not actually thinking hard enough. List the top 6 teams in the last 20 years that are now part of the Big Ten.

1/2 are Ohio State and Nebraska however you want to order them.

3 is Michigan.

Before you say PSU is #4 stop and do a quick check, since coming to the Big Ten PSU has won or shared 3 Big Ten Titles, the same as Wisconsin and 1 more than Iowa.

Also, Northwestern has actually won or tied for 3 Big Ten Titles since PSU arrived and Illinois has played in two BCS Bowls.

East/West isn't as unbalanced as most people would probably expect. The East maybe has a little more fire power at the top but the West holds its own and actually has more depth than the East (Indiana is by far the weakest program in the conference).
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I did some analysis and my results are in this other thread. East/West appears to be balanced in titles but not in 'average' strenghth.

Check it out at the link below.

http://www.forums.gopherhole.com/boards/showthread.php?t=18085
 

And why do we have to call it East or West? I'd call one of them the Nagurski Division and the other one the Red Grange Division.
Stupid, probably. I still hate the NHL for taking away the Smyth, Norris, Adams, Patrick divisions and replacing them with Central, East, and West.
 

I read where one of the goals of adding to the BT is to cut back on travel & related expense. East/West would accomplish that.
 

switch Michigan into the West division and NW into the East division. Guarantee the Michigan-OSU game every year (Gophers could volunteer to face Indiana every year!) and it's a done deal. Really not that far from Chicago to AnnArbor and I doubt if anyone from NW really cares which division they are in, especially if they get the Illinois game guaranteed. Plus Michigan would probably like to get away from MSU. Remember, these divisions will only matter for football, no other sports, so the extra minor travel for Michigan is negligible for 4 road games a year.

West: Minnesota, Michigan, Nebraska, Iowa, WI, Ill
East: OSU, PSU, Indiana, NW, MSU, Purdue

Guaranteed cross-over games: Mich/OSU, maybe NW/Ill; other possibles are Neb/PSU(?), MN/IND(!). Don't really see any other bitter rivalries, could throw in WI/MSU, Iowa/Purdue.

The East might look pretty light but locking OSU/Mich and Neb/PSU games in every year evens things up.
 



so in these divided conferences, how do conference wins and losses play out? Are wins in your own division weighted over wins from the other division in your conference?
 

Mick Turition said:
switch Michigan into the West division and NW into the East division. Guarantee the Michigan-OSU game every year (Gophers could volunteer to face Indiana every year!) and it's a done deal. Really not that far from Chicago to AnnArbor and I doubt if anyone from NW really cares which division they are in, especially if they get the Illinois game guaranteed. Plus Michigan would probably like to get away from MSU. Remember, these divisions will only matter for football, no other sports, so the extra minor travel for Michigan is negligible for 4 road games a year.

West: Minnesota, Michigan, Nebraska, Iowa, WI, Ill
East: OSU, PSU, Indiana, NW, MSU, Purdue

Guaranteed cross-over games: Mich/OSU, maybe NW/Ill; other possibles are Neb/PSU(?), MN/IND(!). Don't really see any other bitter rivalries, could throw in WI/MSU, Iowa/Purdue.
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I agree that to balance the east west Michigan is the logical switch, but I think we'd probably switch both Michigan and Michigan state in order to better maintain rivalries.

This does the foowing:
- Evenly splits the MI OSU PSU NU quartet
- maintains most of the geographic alignment
- keeps together all the big rivalries except MI OSU
- requires one permanent rival in the other division MI/OSU, MSU/PSU, UW/NW, IA/IL, MN/PUR, NU/IN. Permanent rivals would not necessarily have to play the last weekend of the season.

Personally I prefer the pure geographic alignment but both have something to offer to the gophers.
 

Conference games count the same for your division standings regardless of which division you win them against.

I really don't think Michigan wants MSU to follow them to the West. This is very much a 'get away from me little brother' relationship and Michigan would be very happy NOT to play MSU every year. Remember they were very much against MSU joining the Big 10 in the first place.
 

Mick Turition said:
Conference games count the same for your division standings regardless of which division you win them against.

I really don't think Michigan wants MSU to follow them to the West. This is very much a 'get away from me little brother' relationship and Michigan would be very happy NOT to play MSU every year. Remember they were very much against MSU joining the Big 10 in the first place.
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That may be true but I think msu still considers Michigan to be their biggest rival.
 


gopheraschells said:
my only problem with the east west thing is the population balance. Forgive me for being a bit paranoid after all this conference destruction crap, but it just doesn't seem like a good idea putting the majority of the population in the one half.
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You must have missed the part about Illinois being in the West.
In terms of population
West = about 29 million and Growing
East = about 40 million (including the entire state of Pennsylvania) and shrinking

That is actually pretty balanced. Both sides have 2 of the top 4 markets.
 

Rosemountian said:
You must have missed the part about Illinois being in the West.
In terms of population
West = about 29 million and Growing
East = about 40 million (including the entire state of Pennsylvania) and shrinking

That is actually pretty balanced. Both sides have 2 of the top 4 markets.
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Plus the Big Ten's HQ is in Chicago and Chicago is the biggest market they control. They aren't going to give that up so there is no reason to be paranoid.
 

gopheraschells said:
my only problem with the east west thing is the population balance. Forgive me for being a bit paranoid after all this conference destruction crap, but it just doesn't seem like a good idea putting the majority of the population in the one half.
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fail
 

Overthinking the Divisions

It will be an east-west alignment. No records, strengths, rivalries, or other factors will be considered, It WILL be (names only mine):

Great Plains
Illinois
Iowa
Minnesota
Nebraska
Northwestern
Wisconsin

Great Lakes
Indiana
Michigan
Michigan State
Ohio State
Penn State
Purdue

5 games in division, rotating 3 out of division. Championship game at Lucas Oil Stadium, Indianapolis. THINK CLEARLY, PLEASE.

There is no other alignment, there is no other considerations. Get over it, move on.
 

gopheraschells said:
fail
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You are absolutely correct. "Balance" will take care of itself. Nobody give a sh!te about "strength". Get over it. There will be no "evening," there will be no "balancing". Move on. It won't hinge on Min-Mich, or any other "cross-overs". Nobody give a sh!te. Divisions. Geographic. Sign off.
 

rivalry

Yes, as someone said, a rivalry game can still be maintained across divisions. MN would play at least 3 games in the other division each year. If WI was in the other division, it would simply be a protected game which did not rotate off our schedule (just like now, we never have IA or WI go off our schedule). So, there is already inherent inbalance built-in to everyone's BigTen schedule currently.
The only potential issue with this is that of the other 6 teams in your opposing division, you would like play on a two year cycle (home-and-home). So, you could play 3 of the six for two years, and the other 3 teams the next two-years. This way, if a kid is on the roster for 4-year, he plays every team home-and-away at least once in his career. One protected game which is cross-divisional extends the time in which teams would go without meeting at all. (assuming we continue to only play 8 regular season conference games).
 

Priorities of division alignment

According to Jim Delany in Chicago Tribune:

#3 Geography

#2 Traditional rivalries

#1 Competitive balance

Here's my prediction if it's only the current 12. No way they'll put Mich, OSU and PSU in same division.

Iowa
Minnesota
Nebraska (historical power)
Northwestern
Penn State (historical power)
Wisconsin

Illinois
Indiana
Michigan (historical power)
Michigan State
Ohio State (historical power)
Purdue

This way Illinois-Northwestern is the only rivalry being broken up, and I wouldn't really call it much of a rivalry, anyways.
 

SelectionSunday said:
According to Jim Delany in Chicago Tribune:

#3 Geography

#2 Traditional rivalries

#1 Competitive balance

Here's my prediction if it's only the current 12. No way they'll put Mich, OSU and PSU in same division.

Iowa
Minnesota
Nebraska (historical power)
Northwestern
Penn State (historical power)
Wisconsin

Illinois
Indiana
Michigan (historical power)
Michigan State
Ohio State (historical power)
Purdue

This way Illinois-Northwestern is the only rivalry being broken up, and I wouldn't really call it much of a rivalry, anyways.
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SS you got it right! The East/West thing is not going to happen. Never is OSU/Michigan/PSU going to be in the same conference. As you have noted geography is the least of the considerations.

The only change if there is one to your alignment I would make is change Iowa & Nebraska with Michigan and Michigan St. and you would have 1 permanent crossover game every year.

Michigan / OSU
Minnesota / Iowa
PSU / Nebraska
Wisc / Purdue or Indiana
Michigan St / Purdue or Indiana
Northwestern / Illinois
 

SelectionSunday said:
According to Jim Delany in Chicago Tribune:

#3 Geography

#2 Traditional rivalries

#1 Competitive balance

Here's my prediction if it's only the current 12. No way they'll put Mich, OSU and PSU in same division.

Iowa
Minnesota
Nebraska (historical power)
Northwestern
Penn State (historical power)
Wisconsin

Illinois
Indiana
Michigan (historical power)
Michigan State
Ohio State (historical power)
Purdue

This way Illinois-Northwestern is the only rivalry being broken up, and I wouldn't really call it much of a rivalry, anyways.
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PSU considers OSU their biggest rival and it is a protected game under the current scheme.
 

scools12 said:
SS you got it right! The East/West thing is not going to happen. Never is OSU/Michigan/PSU going to be in the same conference. As you have noted geography is the least of the considerations.
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Wisconsin/Iowa/Nebraska are a similar block of college football power as Michigan/Ohio State/ Penn State. Ohio State has easily been #1, so whatever division they land in is going to appear stronger.

The most significant difference between the East and Central is that population and power is has been shifting West in Big Ten Country. And it has been happening quickly. This is one of the reasons for expansion in the first place.
 

Why in the world would PSU, OSU, and Michigan want to be in the same division? Seriously, someone explain that to me.

Especially if there is going to be a notion of protected rivalries? They would have to be absolute morons to support that, and they are the 3 most powerful members of the conference. So we NEVER have an OSU-Mich championship? Doubtful.
 

Goldmember said:
Wisconsin/Iowa/Nebraska are a similar block of college football power as Michigan/Ohio State/ Penn State.
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Though Iowa and Wisconsin have good programs they are not in the same class as Neb/Mich/OSU/PSU in name and that is gonna matter.
 

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