Wittman's cheap shot

[the accomplice]

Was at the game today. (Btw, the atmosphere in the second half was phenomenal.)

Did anyone else notice Wittman Jr's shove to the back of Westbrook? Lawrence did not seem to appreciate it and was jawing quite a bit afterward.

Seemed very bush league as it happened with only 3 or 4 minutes left in the game after Witt Jr. had gone ice cold.

[Dr.Don]

Frustration, that is all. Been there, done that.

[dlw4gophers]

Wanting to take it out on the students for chanting "Fire Randy". LW was the only one he could get close enough to to take it out on. Talk about the D picking up the pace in the 2nd half.

[SelectionSunday]

There was nothing cheap about it. As Dr. Don said, all it was was frustration.

[the accomplice]

Anytime someone pops another player in the back, it's cheap.

I don't give a damn if you are frustrated or not. Wittman took a cheap shot on Westbrook. And he's lucky that Lawrence didn't take him out back and kick his *ss.

I applaud Lawrence for holding his temper.

[From the Barn]

About 99% of all cheap shots result from frustration. Not sure how they are supposed to be mutually exclusive.

[The Big L]

Yep I think most players have been there, so I don't really blame Wittman. Obviously he shouldn't have done it, but all that matters is Lawrence kept his cool, and then it is really a non-issue.

[Dr.Don]

LW played with discipline and not escalating things, Wittman played without discipline if that happened. Our Tubby also teaches discipline, on the floor and off. It takes a stronger person to walk away from a problem, than to retaliate.

[tjgopher]

I didn't think it was exactly "classy" of our fans to be chanting "Fire Randy" while Ryan was on the free throw line, either. Hey, if you want to go to a TWolves game and chant that, go for it. But, chanting that at the coach's kid during a game totally unrelated to the Wolves while the kid's back playing in his home town is close to crossing the line, IMO. I know others will say it isn't, and that's fine. It is my personal opinion that that wasn't particularly original, funny, or classy. But, again, that's just my opinion.

Doesn't excuse the cheap shot that Wittman delivered, but I know if visiting fans took a personal shot at my own father during a game, I might react in an unkind manner, too. So, maybe we should get off the high horse just a bit.

[Sour1729]

I didn't think it was exactly "classy" of our fans to be chanting "Fire Randy" while Ryan was on the free throw line, either. Hey, if you want to go to a TWolves game and chant that, go for it. But, chanting that at the coach's kid during a game totally unrelated to the Wolves while the kid's back playing in his home town is close to crossing the line, IMO. I know others will say it isn't, and that's fine. It is my personal opinion that that wasn't particularly original, funny, or classy. But, again, that's just my opinion.

Doesn't excuse the cheap shot that Wittman delivered, but I know if visiting fans took a personal shot at my own father during a game, I might react in an unkind manner, too. So, maybe we should get off the high horse just a bit.

On a lighter note, the "T-Shirt" chant at Foote was hilarious.

[cheeseheadgophfan]

What was the T-Shirt chant?

[Ski U Mah Gopher]

Chris Foote wore a too large t-shert under his jersey.

[Jim V2]

I didn't think it was exactly "classy" of our fans to be chanting "Fire Randy" while Ryan was on the free throw line, either. Hey, if you want to go to a TWolves game and chant that, go for it. But, chanting that at the coach's kid during a game totally unrelated to the Wolves while the kid's back playing in his home town is close to crossing the line, IMO. I know others will say it isn't, and that's fine. It is my personal opinion that that wasn't particularly original, funny, or classy. But, again, that's just my opinion.

Doesn't excuse the cheap shot that Wittman delivered, but I know if visiting fans took a personal shot at my own father during a game, I might react in an unkind manner, too. So, maybe we should get off the high horse just a bit.


Tj,

I tend to have prety strong opinions about staying classy with the cheers, but I think I disagree with you on this one. YOur father was (presumably) a private citizen, and I agree that attacking him would have been inappropriate. But Randy is not. He is a very highly paid public citizen that gets accused of incompetence etc all the time. Ryan knows that, and has heard it many times. Ryan has plenty of advantages growing up as randy's kid; hopefully his Dad has explained to him that you can't take chants like that personally, because strong criticism is going to happen wherever he goes.

And I'd guess if the game were going well, he'd have just laughed at the chants. As it was, I'm sure the defensive pressure and making free throws was far more on his mind than those chants. In fact, I've stood at the free throw line in an arena with about 10,000 noisy fans, and I barely even heard the crowd--I certainly couldn't tell you what they were yelling--because I was thinking about my shots.

Now if the chants had been about his mother, that's another story.

jim

[Dr.Don]

When I was a kid growing up, and someone tried to insult me by saying, "Your Mother wears Army boots", I would reply, "Yes she does but at least I wear clean underwear and socks."

[tjgopher]

Tj,

I tend to have prety strong opinions about staying classy with the cheers, but I think I disagree with you on this one. YOur father was (presumably) a private citizen, and I agree that attacking him would have been inappropriate. But Randy is not. He is a very highly paid public citizen that gets accused of incompetence etc all the time. Ryan knows that, and has heard it many times. Ryan has plenty of advantages growing up as randy's kid; hopefully his Dad has explained to him that you can't take chants like that personally, because strong criticism is going to happen wherever he goes.

And I'd guess if the game were going well, he'd have just laughed at the chants. As it was, I'm sure the defensive pressure and making free throws was far more on his mind than those chants. In fact, I've stood at the free throw line in an arena with about 10,000 noisy fans, and I barely even heard the crowd--I certainly couldn't tell you what they were yelling--because I was thinking about my shots.

Now if the chants had been about his mother, that's another story.

jim


As I said, not everyone would agree with me. And, my stance is that if you want to battle the highly-paid public figure and ask for his firing, then go to a TWolves game and chant "Fire Randy" until your vocal cords get sore. I just don't think yelling that at his 19-year old son who's playing in his hometown with his mother sitting behind the bench is classy. Again, I appreciate your opinion, but I think we'll just disagree on this one. It isn't a huge deal, but might explain the frustration level of the young kid. As mentioned, if the opposing crowd took on my dad in a personal manner (whether my dad made $2 million/yr or $20,000/yr) I'd be mad and might be liable to do unkind things. I'm sure Ryan loves his father a great deal and didn't like to hear that in his hometown. Not excusing it, just explaining how it might have come to it. By all accounts, the young man is a great kid. I've never met him, but know many people who know him who all say he's a super kid.

My basic point is, that while it might be that his shot on Westbrook was indeed a cheap shot, it likely wasn't out of nowhere or because he is a bad guy.

[TubbytownUSA]

As I said, not everyone would agree with me. And, my stance is that if you want to battle the highly-paid public figure and ask for his firing, then go to a TWolves game and chant "Fire Randy" until your vocal cords get sore. I just don't think yelling that at his 19-year old son who's playing in his hometown with his mother sitting behind the bench is classy. Again, I appreciate your opinion, but I think we'll just disagree on this one. It isn't a huge deal, but might explain the frustration level of the young kid. As mentioned, if the opposing crowd took on my dad in a personal manner (whether my dad made $2 million/yr or $20,000/yr) I'd be mad and might be liable to do unkind things. I'm sure Ryan loves his father a great deal and didn't like to hear that in his hometown. Not excusing it, just explaining how it might have come to it. By all accounts, the young man is a great kid. I've never met him, but know many people who know him who all say he's a super kid.

My basic point is, that while it might be that his shot on Westbrook was indeed a cheap shot, it likely wasn't out of nowhere or because he is a bad guy.

Maybe his dad shouldn't have left the game early then :D Kind of like how he mentally checks out of every Timberwolves game before it even started. That being said, it's warranted to yell for firing him, he's atrocious. That night was his second straight of getting BLOWN OUT.

[From the Barn]

If Randy could coach at all this would be a non-issue.

[TubbytownUSA]

If Randy could coach at all this would be a non-issue.

There's one thing that we can agree on.

[tjgopher]

Maybe his dad shouldn't have left the game early then.

His dad left early because the fans were chanting that. He thought if he left maybe they'd quit chanting and his 19-year old kid wouldn't have to listen to it.

Look, I'm no prude. As I said, Randy's a big boy who makes lots of money. Go to a Wolves game and boo him off the floor, I don't care. But, shouting things at his kid in a college game - to me - is over the top. But, again, it is only my opinion.

[tjgopher]

If Randy could coach at all this would be a non-issue.

Yeah, because the old man can't coach, let's take it out on his son. Not classy, in my opinion.

[GortonsFisherman011]

Yeah, because the old man can't coach, let's take it out on his son. Not classy, in my opinion.

That was being chanted almost directly at him, he even looked over at us when we called him (randy), then we told him he sucks :D

[Jim V2]

I think we'll just disagree on this one. It isn't a huge deal...

My basic point is, that while it might be that his shot on Westbrook was indeed a cheap shot, it likely wasn't out of nowhere or because he is a bad guy.

True, that.

[Blizzard]

That was being chanted almost directly at him, he even looked over at us when we called him (randy), then we told him he sucks.

Who does that and then is proud of it ?

Wittman's got pretty thick skin. Even if the Wolves were decent he'd have his detractors. Wittman seemed friendly, affable, and happy to meet anyone that addressed him. Apparently he at least has some class.

[SelectionSunday]

"That was being chanted almost directly at him, he even looked over at us when we called him (randy), then we told him he sucks."

You must be so proud. Completely classless move if you ask me. The guy's there supporting his kid, leave him alone & give him some peace for a couple hours. If you don't like him, save it for a T-Wolves game. The Barn wasn't the place for that nonsense.

[CollegeBBallFan]

Tj,
I agree. Definitely not classy fans. IMO, the Barn ushers (or cops) should have ushered them out. Too late now.

[From the Barn]

Banned from the barn for chanting?

About half the student section or more would have been gone. What crime was committed for the police to be involved?

[The Big L]

Tj,
I agree. Definitely not classy fans. IMO, the Barn ushers (or cops) should have ushered them out. Too late now.

Some people think those chants crossed the line, others didn't. But to be honest, I'd rather have fans toeing the line, even if it means occasionally crossing it, then sitting back and being apathetic.

And by no means were we doing anything horrible, like racist chants or profanity chants or the stuff Maryland fans said about J.J Reddick's sister.

[Gold Vision]

Some people think those chants crossed the line, others didn't. But to be honest, I'd rather have fans toeing the line, even if it means occasionally crossing it, then sitting back and being apathetic.

And by no means were we doing anything horrible, like racist chants or profanity chants or the stuff Maryland fans said about J.J Reddick's sister.

Agreed, that atmosphere was fantastic in the second half. Anyone who thought Wittman left because he was being chanted too is dilusional. It's college basketball, fans will get rowdy! The biggest threads the past three games have been about the chants that went on during the game, can we concentrate on Basketball for a little while?

[MNSnowman]

And by no means were we doing anything horrible, like racist chants or profanity chants or the stuff Maryland fans said about J.J Reddick's sister. I'll admit that using the "lowest common denominator" justification has always seemed a pretty weak rationale to me. Sorta "damning by faint praise." ;)

[From the Barn]

Its a weak rationale, and no one is claiming that it was classy. Classiness would have been contrary to the objective. But to suggest that people be kicked out of the arena for doing something that isn't even close to what goes on in other arenas, or what has even gone on the barn, is complete ridiculous

[tjgopher]

A few more things -

1) Wittman absolutely left because of the chants. That was 100% of the reason. Why would you think I'm delusional about thinking that? That is rock solid.

2) As to my opinion that this wasn't classy - I stand by it. However, I don't think it was an "arrestable" or "kick them out of the gym" type of offense. It was a classless chant, nothing more, nothing less. I would have preferred the students not chant it, but I haven't had any trouble sleeping at night knowing they did.

3) And, after it all, I tend to slightly agree with the Big L in that if the choice is sitting back and being quiet and not chanting this, or being as loud as they were and putting up with it, then I guess I'd take the loud. However, I'd add that there is no rule that says to be loud and boisterous you have to be unclassy. They are not mutually exclusive. No reason you can't be rowdy and classy. Seriously. I've been to lots of gyms. The best student sections are the ones who are clever, original and funny. As I said early on in this thread, there was nothing particularly original, clever, or funny about "Fire Randy." I think the Barnyard should be able to come up with better. The "T-shirt" chant, for example, was great.

[Blizzard]

1) Wittman absolutely left because of the chants. That was 100% of the reason. Why would you think I'm delusional about thinking that? That is rock solid.

It couldn't have been that the Wolves had a game could it or perhaps you asked him on his way out and he told he was leaving because of the chants ?

[tjgopher]

It couldn't have been that the Wolves had a game could it?

Unless he needed to be at the Target Center four hours before the game, I doubt he needed to quit watching his son in one of the few times he'd get to see him in person.


perhaps you asked him on his way out and he told he was leaving because of the chants ?

He told someone that's why he left. That person relayed it to me. That someone is close friends to the family, who I trust. He didn't want his son to have to hear those things and figured if he left maybe they'd quit. But, that said, I've never talked to Wittman personally, so you could well be right. Maybe I was too strong in claiming it was 100%, but the person who told me this told me immediately after the game that that's what Wittman told him. This person also told me that Randy felt really bad for Ryan about it all.

[From the Barn]

Question since we are on the topic. Lots of the old timers like to bring up that the barn is far from what it once was. Am I really to believe in the chaotic and noisy olden days that the average chant consisted of "Old chap, would you kindly miss this free throw?" There seems to be a bit of a double standard.

[GoGoGophers]

Classless? Man, maybe we are a bit prudish. It's a college basketball game. Students are going to chant some things that may be a bit, um, over the line. Get over it. I remember chanting some pretty bad things at Mateen Cleves' mother in 1999. As long as it's not racist or NC-17, it's going to happen.

I was one of the most outspoken here re: the Anthem fiasco (even getting in contact with our Ath. Dept. about it), but this is a bit much. Do the students need to clear everything with the administration before chanting? Maybe talk to the old folks 1/2 hour before tip to clear it with them?

The kid's dad is a head coach in the NBA, in this city, and he's terrible. He makes ass-loads of money while killing the local team on a nightly basis. I bet the Wittman's don't mind being in the public eye when they cash that huge paycheck every week, or Ryan calls daddy from his Ivy League dorm room wanting another G for a weekend trip to NYC. Please. I thought it was great, and I hope that it is why Randy left early. Grow a spine or don't go out in public.

[tikited]

Unless he needed to be at the Target Center four hours before the game, I doubt he needed to quit watching his son in one of the few times he'd get to see him in person.



He told someone that's why he left. That person relayed it to me. That someone is close friends to the family, who I trust. He didn't want his son to have to hear those things and figured if he left maybe they'd quit. But, that said, I've never talked to Wittman personally, so you could well be right. Maybe I was too strong in claiming it was 100%, but the person who told me this told me immediately after the game that that's what Wittman told him. This person also told me that Randy felt really bad for Ryan about it all.


Wow! What a accomplishment! Some fans screamed at a players dad and forced him to leave the game. Well done, you should all be so proud!

[Gold Vision]

Well the chant has paid dividends today, Wittman has been fired. Now I feel a little guilty.

[MadisonRaisedGopherCrazed]

The kid's dad is a head coach in the NBA, in this city, and he's terrible. He makes ass-loads of money while killing the local team on a nightly basis.

Not anymore hes not

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3754151

Damn! Gold Vision beat me to it.

[From the Barn]

I think we now know why he left.

[GortonsFisherman011]

U of M students are 2 for 2 in getting coaches fired, first Mason now Wittman. Although the latter had nothing to do with the chant...

[jmag21]

I had no problem with the chant. Wittman is horrible. And frankly, if it got in Ryan Wittman's head, it was worth it. Randy Wittman is a public figure who (used to) get paid a lot of money. If a chant would have been directed at Ryan's mom, that would have been different. I don't think it was classless at all.

[CollegeBBallFan]

Code of Conduct
University of Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletics is committed to creating a safe, comfortable, and enjoyable sports and entertainment experience by promoting good sportsmanship through its student-athletes, coaches, and spectators. Any offensive, obscene, racial, or sexist remarks or other threatening actions directed toward coaches, student-athletes, officials, fans, or team representatives will not be tolerated and can be grounds for immediate removal from the facility, as well as further disciplinary action. Patrons appearing intoxicated will be denied entry to the event, and those engaging in fighting or throwing of objects will be ejected from the facility. Patrons who choose not to adhere to these provisions will be subject to ejection without refund and revocation of season tickets and may be in violation of city ordinances, resulting in possible arrest and prosecution.


It would be sad if the Barn fans earned a negative reputation. Show enthusiasm and class. Cheer the team instead!

[GortonsFisherman011]

Code of Conduct
University of Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletics is committed to creating a safe, comfortable, and enjoyable sports and entertainment experience by promoting good sportsmanship through its student-athletes, coaches, and spectators. Any offensive, obscene, racial, or sexist remarks or other threatening actions directed toward coaches, student-athletes, officials, fans, or team representatives will not be tolerated and can be grounds for immediate removal from the facility, as well as further disciplinary action. Patrons appearing intoxicated will be denied entry to the event, and those engaging in fighting or throwing of objects will be ejected from the facility. Patrons who choose not to adhere to these provisions will be subject to ejection without refund and revocation of season tickets and may be in violation of city ordinances, resulting in possible arrest and prosecution.


It would be sad if the Barn fans earned a negative reputation. Show enthusiasm and class. Cheer the team instead!

If you think the Barnyard is the only student section that gets negative then there is no hope for you. If you think that there is a student section at any basketball game in the country that doesn't chant negatively then, again, there is no hope for you.

[From the Barn]

Any offensive, obscene, racial, or sexist remarks or other threatening actions directed toward coaches, student-athletes, officials, fans, or team representatives

So where are the Witman chants covered?

[GoGoGophers]

This thread is stereotypical for the Uff-da/yah sure/"Loot-ern" Minnesota. For a demographic that is small when compared to the total population, it still amazes me how often this comes across.

It kills me when people complain about our student section. Apparently the Eat Sh!t/Eff You chants in Madison and the F- Michigan chants at OSU have nothing on the "Fire Wittman" chant from Saturday. Our student sections have always been lily white when compared to others across the country.

Can you imagine what would happen if they started an ES/FU chant here? My god...the world would come to an end. The U would abolish student sections entirely and issue a 1 page apology in the Strib. Look what the administration did when students started yelling "you suck" during Rock and Roll, part 2. The iron fist came down and the bands cannot play it anymore. Ridiculous.

[DesMoinesGopher]

I have never understood why some fans feel it is necessary to attack members of the student section for the content of their chants, cheers, signs, and any other form of expression. I have always felt that so long as no obscene, racists, or other highly offensive remarks were made, there is no problem.

As others have already indicated, there are much worse and much more hostile environments around the country. In fact, I wish the members of the student section would be more rowdy. The more raucous, the better.

[tjgopher]

Let's get back to the original topic of this thread, which was titled "Wittman's Cheapshot." People took exception to Wittman's antics. I was simply trying to explain that maybe Wittman's cheap shot wasn't without some instigation. I personally feel the chant lacked class and was not the right forum. Others feel otherwise, and that's fine. As I said, I haven't lost a wink of sleep about the chant and don't think it was worth kicking anyone out. I'm just saying that before we go nuts about "Wittman's Cheapshot" let's take the entire day in context. Not excusing the cheapshot, just saying sometimes good people do silly things when their family members get attacked.

And, yes, I'm all for a rowdy, loud, boisterous Barnyard. I'd like them to become more creative, original, and clever with their chants and cheers. They should get/steal some ideas from the Izzone, The Paint Crew, The Orange Crush, etc. I remember a game last year or the year before at Cameron Indoor when the Dukies were playing a game against a team with a kid named Walker. He travelled once and it wasn't called. The Crazies (everyone in the section) began making the traveling signal in unison (looked fantastic) and began chanting "Watch Walker Walk! Watch Walker Walk!" Everytime they yelled Walk, they motioned toward the Duke end like an official would. Announcers even mentioned it. Then, lo and behold, a few possessions later he travelled again, it was called, and the place absolutely blew up. Game specific stuff is awesome.

I think there is huge potential here. This is the best Gopher student section in at least 5 years, so that is awesome. I'm certainly not trying to lessen their enthusiasm. Just hoping they can direct that energy into a really good effort every night. They have been really, really good that last two games. Keep it up!

[tikited]

If you think the Barnyard is the only student section that gets negative then there is no hope for you. If you think that there is a student section at any basketball game in the country that doesn't chant negatively then, again, there is no hope for you.

Well, that pretty much doesn't have anything to do with anything, but if you think it makes it cool...

The point is this: Some think chanting and screaming at a players dad, in the stands, is pretty classless. Others think it's cool because other fans do worse. To each their own.

[the accomplice]

- some think it's okay to excuse a purposeful action because of words that instigated it. That's total bull**it. I don't care what was said. What happens if Lawrence gets hurt because of little Ryan's actions? Are you all still running to defend Ryan? Those who defend things like this are pathetic.

I can't stand the attitude that forgives actions like Ryan's. He proved he is a punk BY HIS ACTIONS!!! Lawrence didn't start the chant. He just proved he's a much better person than Ryan.

And if his Dad can't handle a 'chant' from a bunch of college students he shouldn't be a coach in the first place. Or maybe he shouldn't suck.

[GortonsFisherman011]

Well, that pretty much doesn't have anything to do with anything, but if you think it makes it cool...

The point is this: Some think chanting and screaming at a players dad, in the stands, is pretty classless. Others think it's cool because other fans do worse. To each their own.

No, we think its cool because its funny and he sucked :)

[From the Barn]

and it worked.

[MNSnowman]

and it worked. So this is simply a case of the ends justifying the means, I guess.

Let's see, we now have justification for the chant based upon:


other student sections behave worse than ours;
Randy Wittman makes too much money;
Randy Wittman is a public figure;
Randy Wittman isn't a competent coach;
if it gets in the head of an opposing player or team it's okay;
Lutherans exert disproportionate influence and reticence; and,
The students are young and thus cannot be accountable in their fandom.

I'm waiting for someone to blame it on Monson and Haskins. ;)

[Dr.Don]

I will quote my late Father, when I was young: "Have all the fun you want, just do NOT hurt anyone or cause any damage." Yelling and chanting at games, if it does neither of the above, I say Gopher It!!!!! One of the reasons I had fun playing high school and college ball was to try verbally get into the head of my opponent. I did NOT hurt anyone nor cause any damage. Let the students have fun, as long as they do NOT......

[GophersInIowa]

Should the student section stop chanting "airball" then? That may hurt the player's feelings just like it did to Wittman's. He is a public figure, what does he expect?

As someone who went to a bunch of ACC games at Wake Forest, Duke, Carolina, and Maryland, I find it kind of funny that this is really even an issue to some.

[Dr.Don]

G-I-I. Agreed totally with you. But if they do it, part of the game, if we do, not Minnesota Nice....Bulllllllllllll-------------. Agree...a non-issue. Have a good day, all.

[GoGoGophers]

You're absolutely right, GophsInIoway. Chanting "airball" at an opposing player is mean-spirited. A Gopher player may someday shoot an airball in a game, and we wouldn't want opposing fans to give him the business. Do unto others, doncha know.

And another thing...quit taunting players after they foul out. It only will exacerbate the negative feelings that they are no doubt battling. Marching them off to "left, right" is not Minnesota Nice.

We should try to be friendly to our guests in the Barn. Only cheer on the Gophers in a positive way; be quiet when the other team is attempting to play the basketball. As Snowman pointed out, it shouldn't matter what other students sections or opposing fans do, we are better than that and should treat Gopher games more like a meet and greet and a scrimmage game.

BE NICE!

[vaporboy]

Excellent levity. I was getting bored with this thread and you somehow made sense of the rabble.

[From the Barn]

Actually, no one did anything wrong and no one needs to justify anything.

[XMan]

Not classy.

[tikited]

- some think it's okay to excuse a purposeful action because of words that instigated it. That's total bull**it. I don't care what was said. What happens if Lawrence gets hurt because of little Ryan's actions? Are you all still running to defend Ryan? Those who defend things like this are pathetic.

I can't stand the attitude that forgives actions like Ryan's. He proved he is a punk BY HIS ACTIONS!!! Lawrence didn't start the chant. He just proved he's a much better person than Ryan.

And if his Dad can't handle a 'chant' from a bunch of college students he shouldn't be a coach in the first place. Or maybe he shouldn't suck.

You missed the point. I wasn't defending the player. I was saying how ripping on a players dad in the stands and screaming that he sucks is classless. If you think otherwise, well then, you are classless. I didn't see the play in question, so I can't comment on it.

[Goph4phan]

I remember a few years back when Ryan Saunders was playing HS ball for Wayzata and Flip was still coaching the Wolves, fans would chant all kinds of obscenities at him. They'd chant things like "little flip", etc. the whole game. It didn't appear to bother him much. I understand that different athletes have different thresholds for verbal attacks, however, there is still no reason for him to push LW, or anyone for that matter.

Personally, I'd rather have our students wild, loud and crazy. Sure, you don't need to be criticizing ones immediate family members to achieve this, but, it may happen occasionally, and I'm fine with that. They got into the head of Ryan. He still scored 21pts but shot a terrible 31% from the field, including 4-14 from 3.

Thank you members of The Barn Yard!

[calminnfan]

His dad left early because the fans were chanting that. He thought if he left maybe they'd quit chanting and his 19-year old kid wouldn't have to listen to it.

Look, I'm no prude. As I said, Randy's a big boy who makes lots of money. Go to a Wolves game and boo him off the floor, I don't care. But, shouting things at his kid in a college game - to me - is over the top. But, again, it is only my opinion.

I agree. Did not care to hear about it myself!

[Dr.Don]

BIG DEAL....END THIS THREAD. THANKS.