Am I the only one confused by the recent commits?

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EG#9

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In the past few days, the Gophers have added 3 OL who, combined, have a total of one offer from a BCS school (and that was Indiana). The players hail from Wisconsin and Illinois and neither of the Big Ten schools offered any of them per rivals. They might be great players, but the offer list is much more Mason-like than Brewster like. I hope this is not a regression in recruiting, but rather the staff locking up some guys early who would have gotten big time offers later in the process. I find that a bit hard to believe though considering the players don't hail from states where it is easy to fall below the radar like California, Florida, and Texas.
 

EG#9 said:
They might be great players, but the offer list is much more Mason-like than Brewster like.
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Mason had pretty good offensive lines :)

I'm not too worried, remember these are building blocks around Seantrel :p
 

I have the exact same concerns. Like you say, this doesn't mean that these players will not turn out to be phenomenal players, but the quality of their listed offers is a bit of a concern for me.
 

EG#9 said:
In the past few days, the Gophers have added 3 OL who, combined, have a total of one offer from a BCS school (and that was Indiana). The players hail from Wisconsin and Illinois and neither of the Big Ten schools offered any of them per rivals. They might be great players, but the offer list is much more Mason-like than Brewster like. I hope this is not a regression in recruiting, but rather the staff locking up some guys early who would have gotten big time offers later in the process. I find that a bit hard to believe though considering the players don't hail from states where it is easy to fall below the radar like California, Florida, and Texas.
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While it is extremely early in the recruiting cycle, I am slightly confused and or concerned as well. I think whenever there is a coaching change the first year or two it is easier to sell recruits on a new vision and direction for the program and as such you see a bump up in recruiting but in subsequent years that message loses meaning and it is all about winning the big games and competing for championships with the top level reccruits. However, being this early we cannot say that this is necessarily going on here, after all we are not USC and cannot have an entire roster of high school all americans.
 

I am not concerned at this point. It is early in the recruiting process and I've been pleased with the staff's evaluation of talent in the past. I am not about to doubt them right now, especially given they know much more about the roster and what is going on behind the scene.
 


I think it is much easier for me to drink the Koolaid with linemen. With the rare exceptions (read S. Henderson) few are developed enough coming directly out of high school to come in and make a huge impact at this level, if not completely getting owned on the field. It is a big man's game and lets be honest it is hard to expect an 18 who has been only seriously developing in the weight room maybe for a couple of years to come in and not get pushed around by 20 year olds who have had several solid years in world class condition programs.

I'd like to think that Davis sees something in these athletes that makes him think that he can redshirt 'em and turn them into serious contenders in two to three years. But when it comes to linemen, it is harder to identify those little intangibles that will predict who is going to be it in two years, versus a flashy skilled position. Some of the greatest linemen the midwest produces go under recruited or acknowledged by national media for years until suddenly they are upperclassmen and making big impacts and all-american performance type holes.
 

ulfr said:
I think it is much easier for me to drink the Koolaid with linemen. With the rare exceptions (read S. Henderson) few are developed enough coming directly out of high school to come in and make a huge impact at this level, if not completely getting owned on the field. It is a big man's game and lets be honest it is hard to expect an 18 who has been only seriously developing in the weight room maybe for a couple of years to come in and not get pushed around by 20 year olds who have had several solid years in world class condition programs.

I'd like to think that Davis sees something in these athletes that makes him think that he can redshirt 'em and turn them into serious contenders in two to three years. But when it comes to linemen, it is harder to identify those little intangibles that will predict who is going to be it in two years, versus a flashy skilled position. Some of the greatest linemen the midwest produces go under recruited or acknowledged by national media for years until suddenly they are upperclassmen and making big impacts and all-american performance type holes.
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I completely agree. The one position that it does not bother me in the slightest to take lightly regarded players is the offensive line. To me, that is the position that is built the most in a program through weight training and coaching.
 

enough mediocre OL talent! Henderson and that is it for the OL. How about focusing on the DL where we need a ton of help????
 

ulfr said:
I think it is much easier for me to drink the Koolaid with linemen. With the rare exceptions (read S. Henderson) few are developed enough coming directly out of high school to come in and make a huge impact at this level, if not completely getting owned on the field. It is a big man's game and lets be honest it is hard to expect an 18 who has been only seriously developing in the weight room maybe for a couple of years to come in and not get pushed around by 20 year olds who have had several solid years in world class condition programs.

I'd like to think that Davis sees something in these athletes that makes him think that he can redshirt 'em and turn them into serious contenders in two to three years. But when it comes to linemen, it is harder to identify those little intangibles that will predict who is going to be it in two years, versus a flashy skilled position. Some of the greatest linemen the midwest produces go under recruited or acknowledged by national media for years until suddenly they are upperclassmen and making big impacts and all-american performance type holes.
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A certain team to your south has been doing this successfully for years. That state doesn't churn out 3 - 4 five star lineman each year either.
 



SoMplsHawkI said:
A certain team to your south has been doing this successfully for years. That state doesn't churn out 3 - 4 five star lineman each year either.
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SoMplsHawk,

Your statement above is NOT accurate. The state of Texas seemingly cranks out multiple 5-star OL's every year!!:p
 

I am not concerned...look at Nebraska...during the Osborne years their philosophy was recruit body types at OL and then spend 2-3 years building their strength, stamina and skill. That program put an OL in the NFL every year for over a decade and never had a recruit over 4 stars and many that were not even 2 stars.

If we are truly building a system that we plan on having for the next 10 years then recruit body types and build your OL. If next year we have a new OC and DC or HC, then what does it matter.
 

also, i think this is our largest scholly year, so we can afford to take some chances on offers. i forgot the exact number, but does someone know how many we have this year?
 

With HS O linemen, you look at mobility, feet, attitude, and work ethic. Then you pack on bulk, strength, and teach technique. Look at video of Gjere for example, amazing mobility and feet.
As far as size goes, Ryan Wynn and Trey Davis came to the U at about 250, they're now close to 290 or so, granted tough examples since they played about 3 years too soon, but size isn't difficult to improve over a few years.
 



Stoodabaker said:
enough mediocre OL talent! Henderson and that is it for the OL. How about focusing on the DL where we need a ton of help????
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There's always a chance one of these three recent commits is projected to shift to the defensive side of the ball.
 

This Staff

If there is only one area in which we should trust this staff, it should be recruiting. I think they know what they are doing and trust their motives, whatever they may be.
It think it was pretty obvious that Davis didn't like the OL roster he inherited and wanted a lot of new blood, his type of guys. Guys with less offers or publicity usually have more 'want' and will work very hard for a future spot.
 

tjgesquire said:
If there is only one area in which we should trust this staff, it should be recruiting. I think they know what they are doing and trust their motives, whatever they may be.
It think it was pretty obvious that Davis didn't like the OL roster he inherited and wanted a lot of new blood, his type of guys. Guys with less offers or publicity usually have more 'want' and will work very hard for a future spot.[/QUOTE]

I bet this is why we are cooling on Seantrel ;)
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I'm a little concerned (add in the fact that we also gave a scholly to a kicker in this time period), but less so if the coaching staff thinks we're going to get Henderson. Henderson and Gjere are two of the top 5 or so O-linemen in the country, so mix them in with a couple of these developmental projects and it's the best O-line class in the country this year by any standard.

Another point to consider is this -- given the difficulty in projecting out O-linemen, we finish recruiting that position early knowing that the 4* we could get later may well be no better than the 3* we take now. Thus we can now concentrate all of our recruiting efforts, time, etc. on the skill positions where the ratings usually prove more valuable and the recruiting competition is going to be tough.
 

Ole said:
With HS O linemen, you look at mobility, feet, attitude, and work ethic. Then you pack on bulk, strength, and teach technique. Look at video of Gjere for example, amazing mobility and feet.
As far as size goes, Ryan Wynn and Trey Davis came to the U at about 250, they're now close to 290 or so, granted tough examples since they played about 3 years too soon, but size isn't difficult to improve over a few years.
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Look at like this. Two of these guys in the past might have took a last second late season offer from Wisconsin, and they would have red shirted (like they might for us) and had a good chance of becoming a solid lineman in 1-2 years.

Now they are here and not there. Hopefully we did a better job of identifying talent.
 

Everyone needs to remember that we can sign a full class (25 + 3 oversigns) this year, so there's plenty of space. Without even touching this oversign territory, we can bring in 16 more kids. If the staff were to land Henderson, and even if one of the bigger name OLs that had been out there (say, Bolton) commits, we still have 14 more spots. Maybe take a running back, a receiver or two, one more corner (remember, right now we have two), a pair of safetys, and you're still left with 8-9 scholarships for just defensive line and linebackers if you choose. And this is without resorting to any oversigning, which Brewster has shown he's willing to do.

There will be space for big names should they come along later in the process. Don't be too concerned.
 

Most definitely, but I'm more interested in what they can do for us, rather than what they won't do for wisky. Take a look at their videos, really they are pretty solid looking linemen, good quickness, pancake block toughness, tenacity in getting to the second level, like I said before, watch Gjere's feet and how smooth he is getting out (he's a guard in HS and pulls alot), watch Epping and Eggen's overall run blocking, they are both solid road graders, and the newest guy is uber quick
 

It is way to early, IMO, to figure what will happen with Henderson one way or another. I do believe the U has a legitimate chance at him, but they are in stiff competition with top school. Regardless of how many OLmen are recruited, if Sentral says yes to MN, he will get the Scholarship.

My suspicion is that Davis seen something, as Ulfr pointed out, that the three can be developed. As Sid likes to point out, the U has developed 2 star undersized linemen in the past and they are in the pros.
 

Calminn, the comments about seantrel being a lock were obviously made in jest. We are up against some very tough competition for him, but the fact that we are still in the running and likely will remain there until the end is encouraging. Especially since it appears that he has eliminated Notre Dame from his list :)
 

DiehardGopher said:
Calminn, the comments about seantrel being a lock were obviously made in jest. We are up against some very tough competition for him, but the fact that we are still in the running and likely will remain there until the end is encouraging. Especially since it appears that he has eliminated Notre Dame from his list :)
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Actually I was referring to loading up on OLmen in replace of Henderson. I think Henderson has the U as a legitimate possibility myself, but I don't know if home field is going to be the deciding factor. Home state loyalties only go so far. I do think Davis is going to be a big help and that he may be waiting to see how the season goes before committing.
 

parkinglotgopher said:
There's always a chance one of these three recent commits is projected to shift to the defensive side of the ball.
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VERY likely, I think even Scout has Epping listed as a DL, so I wouldn't just assume all these guys are going to the O-line and that's that.
 

IMO, if Campion can hold down the center position then Epping will be moved to DT. Looking at his tape the kid is nasty on the DL and does a nice job of blowing up the interior.
 

Remember we have quite a few OLinemen in front of these guys, including 3 highly touted Freshmen coming in this year. With that it will give these guys plenty of time to develop. It's not like they need to play right away. They have at least 3 years to develop and bulk up, their Senior year in HS, a redshirt year and their Freshmen year before they might even become starters. Three years is alot of time.
 

I never thought I would see the day when gopher fans were whining about 3 star lineman being recruited

they are all in the 6'5" range with good feet

call me baffled to say the least

I am pumped
 

I would also assume the coaching staff looks for, or sees, a certain attitude... and it is really hard to bulk up on this and maybe even harder to train or coach. IMHO, either you have it or you don't. It could also be read as desire, but at any rate this type of positive mentality will help a great deal too, as these young men develop.

Perhaps in this case, something more between the ears… ultimately helps us between the ends!
 

First off, there's more to recruiting than star ratings. Think back to the Mason years. At this time of the year the previous staff were getting commitments from 0-1 star players and then duking it out for 3 star left overs in Febuary. Some of those 0 star guys turned out to be pretty good, but I would rather have 10 3 star recruits in July than getting these 10 in January. We can fight for 5s and 4s after the season with the knowledge that we have a fundamentally solid group to build off of. Recruits are movtivated by a number of factors, foremost of which, in my opinion, is winning. If they see that there's a better chance of winning here they will come. They come to that conclusion more quickly when they see scholarship start disappearing. The coaches can now better focus their efforts on a smaller pool of players and they can say you better hurry or else there won't be any scholarships left. Obviously not all these players will pan out, but you have to make an educated guess on who's worth the risk and use whatever motivational angle you can muster to try to get the kid to commit. I applaud the coaches for trying to be smart about these things. A couple good recruiting classes and now some of us are too good for these kinds. Think about the past and compare it to what we have now, recruitingwise, and you will see a difference. Players are commiting now, who in the past would be more likely to wait and see who else offered. I for one, see this as a positive step forward. We've been down so long. In most of our lifetimes we've never been to the Rose Bowl or even played on New Year's Day. Now we're on course, with the new stadium, toward perhaps seeing our team be competitive again. I wouldn't get to worked up about this or that until this fall.
 

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