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MaroonGopher

MaroonGopher

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To me, the Battle 4 Atlantis existed no further than in crisp game photos from Gophersports.com, 30 second highlights on BTN and, of course, Official Game Threads from Gopherhole.

BUT...

I am a happy fan.

What a great tournament!!! Of course I would have rather finished 3-0, but losing to a DUKE team that shot over 50% is nothing to panic about. Beating a top 20 team by almost 10 and exacting revenge against Stanford is reason to be optimistic. I believe the Gophers should be ranked come Monday morning, possibly within the top 20. When was the last time there has been as much buzz and optimism around this program? Yes, they do turn the ball over way too much, but that's a product of the system and the fact that it's still very early. The offense appears to be clicking -- at least in spurts -- and the defense sounds strong. This team is full of athletes and a stud, playmaking PG and SF. Mbakwe recorded his first dub-dub against Stanford and will only get better. He, Dre and Williams will be formidable this year and no doubt take over their share of games. I'm not totally sure how Austin did against Stanford but he had something like five steals, six assists and six rebounds against Memphis. As a fantasy basketball buff, I especially love those numbers. You clearly don't have to score a bunch of points to contribute to a victory. So, we've got four potential all-conference players. There is a significant drop off from our fourth and fifth best players, but I wouldn't say that guys like Coleman, Welch, Walker and Maverick are completely incompetent. They each bring something valuable to the table; Coleman and his ability to drive and hit free throws; Welch and his 3-point shooting; Walker and his size; Maverick and his experience. Elliot, Oto and Ingram have a long way to go in proving to this fan that they deserve more than 10 minutes a game.
 

I really don't think the Gophers will be ranked. You lose by 18 to Duke on a neutral court and expect to jump into the rankings afterward? It's not like they beat Indiana and Louisville after the Duke game. The Gophers got a couple good wins, but it is doubtful that any of their wins so far would be against top-25 teams in the next poll. The Gophers had a decent performance in Atlantis, but there aren't any teams in the country that would go from unranked to ranked after losing by 18 to Duke, and then beating Memphis and Stanford teams that haven't stood out this year.
 

OSUfan said:
I really don't think the Gophers will be ranked. You lose by 18 to Duke on a neutral court and expect to jump into the rankings afterward? It's not like they beat Indiana and Louisville after the Duke game. The Gophers got a couple good wins, but it is doubtful that any of their wins so far would be against top-25 teams in the next poll. The Gophers had a decent performance in Atlantis, but there aren't any teams in the country that would go from unranked to ranked after losing by 18 to Duke, and then beating Memphis and Stanford teams that haven't stood out this year.
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Not saying they deserve to jump up a bunch of spots, but I am not sure what teams ranked 20-25 did? Memphis will drop out I am sure, but I dont know if the other teams lost multiple games over the week. If that happens they might jump up. I think most people would agree that MN is probably in the 20-30 range right now. Not a major player, but looking like a NCAA caliber team...
 


OSUfan said:
I really don't think the Gophers will be ranked. You lose by 18 to Duke on a neutral court and expect to jump into the rankings afterward? It's not like they beat Indiana and Louisville after the Duke game. The Gophers got a couple good wins, but it is doubtful that any of their wins so far would be against top-25 teams in the next poll. The Gophers had a decent performance in Atlantis, but there aren't any teams in the country that would go from unranked to ranked after losing by 18 to Duke, and then beating Memphis and Stanford teams that haven't stood out this year.
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I think it's a toss up whether the'll be ranked or not. Won't surprise me either way. They were right on the border before the Duke game (most votes of the non-top 25 teams in the AP poll). Losing to the 5th ranked team isn't going to drop them all that far. Beating the #19 team brings them back up some and then beating Stanford, a team with top 25 votes, brings them up some more. If they aren't ranked they'll be right on the border.
 


I'll guess that Memphis falls out and we squeeze in. Wisconsin was behind us at #27 and they won't pass us.
 

Not surprised if the Gophers are or are not ranked. Depends on what the lower ranked teams do.
 


JMO: There are some publicity / recognition aspects involved in the rankings. Would have helped to have the two Gopher wins on national TV (ESPN). ESPN talked up Andre's 41 point game. Maybe the unusual finish with Stanford will get some additional press.
 



Reagardless of the rankings, it should be a good road test for our boys:
Others Receiving Votes:
Minnesota 93,
Wisconsin 60,
Pittsburgh 43,
Notre Dame 40,
Texas 25,
St. Joseph's 24,
Florida St. 15,
 

OSUfan said:
I really don't think the Gophers will be ranked. You lose by 18 to Duke on a neutral court and expect to jump into the rankings afterward? It's not like they beat Indiana and Louisville after the Duke game. The Gophers got a couple good wins, but it is doubtful that any of their wins so far would be against top-25 teams in the next poll. The Gophers had a decent performance in Atlantis, but there aren't any teams in the country that would go from unranked to ranked after losing by 18 to Duke, and then beating Memphis and Stanford teams that haven't stood out this year.
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Gophers should absolutely be ranked. They were just outside the top-25 coming into the tourney with a quality win against Richmond. Now we beast a ranked team in Memphis & a solid Stanford team, why wouldn't we move up a couple spots?
 

Truthfully, even if the Gophers arrive at 25 or 24, it will take a win at FSU to maintain it. That will show we belong.
 

If we are at #26, we are the top of the rest.

If we are at #25, we are the bottom of the rest.

Decisions, decisions, decisions.
 



Costa Rican Gopher said:
Gophers should absolutely be ranked. They were just outside the top-25 coming into the tourney with a quality win against Richmond. Now we beast a ranked team in Memphis & a solid Stanford team, why wouldn't we move up a couple spots?
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see you conveniently left out the blowout loss to Duke.
 

From the Barn said:
Going from #26 to #25 isn't too hard to do OSUfan.
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It's not hard to go from 26 to 25, but it is hard to move up after you lose. That's how the rankings generally work - you win, you move up. You lose, you don't.
 

scools12 said:
see you conveniently left out the blowout loss to Duke.
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OSUfan said:
It's not hard to go from 26 to 25, but it is hard to move up after you lose. That's how the rankings generally work - you win, you move up. You lose, you don't.
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If, and it's a big if, the voters actually watched the Duke game then they would know that the Gophers didn't play badly but Duke just played out of their minds. No one was going to beat the Blue Devils that night and if they end up winning this very competitive tournament then I don't think the loss will hurt much if at all.

I agree that usually when you lose it hurts your rankings but when that loss comes to the #5 team in the country and is followed up by two quality wins including a win over a ranked opponent then the story is a little different. I guess I wouldn't be shocked if we weren't ranked in the next poll but I am definitely expecting it.
 

OSUfan said:
It's not hard to go from 26 to 25, but it is hard to move up after you lose. That's how the rankings generally work - you win, you move up. You lose, you don't.
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I already replied to this post by it vanished somehow (if by staff please send a personal notification to me explaining why).

You are missing we lost to #5, won vs. #19 and then won again.

L-W-W, we should move up considering the competition and what happened to other ranked teams.
 

It's a Pig Man! said:
If, and it's a big if, the voters actually watched the Duke game then they would know that the Gophers didn't play badly but Duke just played out of their minds. No one was going to beat the Blue Devils that night and if they end up winning this very competitive tournament then I don't think the loss will hurt much if at all.

I agree that usually when you lose it hurts your rankings but when that loss comes to the #5 team in the country and is followed up by two quality wins including a win over a ranked opponent then the story is a little different. I guess I wouldn't be shocked if we weren't ranked in the next poll but I am definitely expecting it.
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The bold statement, the first part I completely disagree with. The second part, Duke winning the tournament softening the blow of the loss, it could be true but I doubt it will help put the Gophers in the top-25. Duke I feel is not going to end up in the Elite 8 this year, there are going to be at least 8 teams that finish ahead of them in the tournament at the end. I don't know who they all are yet, I just know that Duke is winning based on being more prepared and organized at this time, they do not have as much room for growth as a team based on increasing their offensive and defensive efficiency as a lot of others. Coach K is doing a good job of getting Duke to capitalize on November, as his team will likely suffer some losses to teams that you would think they shouldn't lose to, simply because they aren't as talented as some of his past great Duke teams. For example, Duke won't be able to beat Kentucky at the end of the year, so good job for K to schedule them early when they could capitalize on their experience advantage against a more talented team and get a resume win to help inflate their seed. Duke was very fortunate that Louisville's Gorgui Dieng, one of the nation's premier big men and perhaps the best shotblocker, missed the Duke game due to injury or else they would've lost.

Memphis is not a win you should keep clinging to as a top-25 win. Yes, technically they were in the top-25, but they lost 2 games, one against a VCU team that went 1-2 in the tournament, and the Tigers weren't rated particularly highly to start with so they will almost certainly drop out of the top-25. Frankly, the Ohio Bobcats have more of a case for being snubbed by the rankings than the Gophers would - Sweet 16 last year, bring literally everybody back who played for them but unranked to start the season, and they dominated Richmond yesterday and are undefeated this year.

At this point in the season, there are probably 100 other teams with 0 or 1 losses. Have the Gophers really distinguished themselves to be among the top-25 of the 100 teams with similar records? I don't think so.
 

OSUfan said:
the Tigers weren't rated particularly highly to start with so they will almost certainly drop out of the top-25.
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True, but at the end of the season they will be a top-25 because they will dominate their conference. They lost to us and VCU, 2 teams that should be in the top-25 by the end of the season too. Memphis is not as bad as you're painting them to be.
 

OSUfan said:
The bold statement, the first part I completely disagree with. The second part, Duke winning the tournament softening the blow of the loss, it could be true but I doubt it will help put the Gophers in the top-25. Duke I feel is not going to end up in the Elite 8 this year, there are going to be at least 8 teams that finish ahead of them in the tournament at the end. I don't know who they all are yet, I just know that Duke is winning based on being more prepared and organized at this time, they do not have as much room for growth as a team based on increasing their offensive and defensive efficiency as a lot of others. Coach K is doing a good job of getting Duke to capitalize on November, as his team will likely suffer some losses to teams that you would think they shouldn't lose to, simply because they aren't as talented as some of his past great Duke teams. For example, Duke won't be able to beat Kentucky at the end of the year, so good job for K to schedule them early when they could capitalize on their experience advantage against a more talented team and get a resume win to help inflate their seed. Duke was very fortunate that Louisville's Gorgui Dieng, one of the nation's premier big men and perhaps the best shotblocker, missed the Duke game due to injury or else they would've lost.

Memphis is not a win you should keep clinging to as a top-25 win. Yes, technically they were in the top-25, but they lost 2 games, one against a VCU team that went 1-2 in the tournament, and the Tigers weren't rated particularly highly to start with so they will almost certainly drop out of the top-25. Frankly, the Ohio Bobcats have more of a case for being snubbed by the rankings than the Gophers would - Sweet 16 last year, bring literally everybody back who played for them but unranked to start the season, and they dominated Richmond yesterday and are undefeated this year.

At this point in the season, there are probably 100 other teams with 0 or 1 losses. Have the Gophers really distinguished themselves to be among the top-25 of the 100 teams with similar records? I don't think so.
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Duke just beat Kentucky and Louisville, give credit where credit is due. They also have a couple freshman that will be much better at the end of the year.

And for the gophers, any neutral site win against a good apponent is a good win, top 25 or not. Especially considering the team is not playing very well and has a lot of room for improvement.
 

OSUfan also tried to convince us that last season's Buckeye win over a South Carolina team that eventually went 10-21 was a good and meaningful win. So perhaps arguing with him on such subjects is a lost cause.
 

OSUfan said:
The bold statement, the first part I completely disagree with. The second part, Duke winning the tournament softening the blow of the loss, it could be true but I doubt it will help put the Gophers in the top-25. Duke I feel is not going to end up in the Elite 8 this year, there are going to be at least 8 teams that finish ahead of them in the tournament at the end. I don't know who they all are yet, I just know that Duke is winning based on being more prepared and organized at this time, they do not have as much room for growth as a team based on increasing their offensive and defensive efficiency as a lot of others. Coach K is doing a good job of getting Duke to capitalize on November, as his team will likely suffer some losses to teams that you would think they shouldn't lose to, simply because they aren't as talented as some of his past great Duke teams. For example, Duke won't be able to beat Kentucky at the end of the year, so good job for K to schedule them early when they could capitalize on their experience advantage against a more talented team and get a resume win to help inflate their seed. Duke was very fortunate that Louisville's Gorgui Dieng, one of the nation's premier big men and perhaps the best shotblocker, missed the Duke game due to injury or else they would've lost.

Memphis is not a win you should keep clinging to as a top-25 win. Yes, technically they were in the top-25, but they lost 2 games, one against a VCU team that went 1-2 in the tournament, and the Tigers weren't rated particularly highly to start with so they will almost certainly drop out of the top-25. Frankly, the Ohio Bobcats have more of a case for being snubbed by the rankings than the Gophers would - Sweet 16 last year, bring literally everybody back who played for them but unranked to start the season, and they dominated Richmond yesterday and are undefeated this year.

At this point in the season, there are probably 100 other teams with 0 or 1 losses. Have the Gophers really distinguished themselves to be among the top-25 of the 100 teams with similar records? I don't think so.
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You are entitled to your opinion but I firmly believe that Duke was essentially unbeatable. They basically couldn't miss anything that they threw up at the rim and anyone that watched the game would know that it was not a bad performance by the Gophers, but just an unbelievable performance by Duke. You clearly hold a belief that Duke is not an elite team and that's fine, but the fact of the matter is that we lost to a team that has beaten Kentucky (even if they are not clicking yet) and Louisville, two top 5 teams.

You are really missing the point that we were already ranked at 26, we beat two quality opponents, and our one loss was to the soon to be either #1 or #2 team in the country who had an incredible shooting night. At least one team, Memphis, will fall out of the rankings and it seems to make sense that we would replace them. Like I said, I can see a scenario where we don't get in but I am expecting the Gophers to make the top 25. You are more than welcome to disagree and in the end we'll all find out tomorrow.
 

It's a Pig Man! said:
If, and it's a big if, the voters actually watched the Duke game then they would know that the Gophers didn't play badly but Duke just played out of their minds. No one was going to beat the Blue Devils that night and if they end up winning this very competitive tournament then I don't think the loss will hurt much if at all.

I agree that usually when you lose it hurts your rankings but when that loss comes to the #5 team in the country and is followed up by two quality wins including a win over a ranked opponent then the story is a little different. I guess I wouldn't be shocked if we weren't ranked in the next poll but I am definitely expecting it.
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+1
 

Really don't understand the infatuation with being ranked in November. Tubby's teams have done that before and it didn't make any difference come February and March. Much rather see them ranked at the end of year and not peak in December.
 

scools12 said:
Really don't understand the infatuation with being ranked in November. Tubby's teams have done that before and it didn't make any difference come February and March. Much rather see them ranked at the end of year and not peak in December.
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Being ranked whether it be pre-season, post-season, or anything in between is good for the program. Everyone here is well aware that it's better to be ranked at the end of the season than in November, so thank you for your enlightening statement. We've all grown just a little bit smarter thanks to you.
 

afurry91 said:
Being ranked whether it be pre-season, post-season, or anything in between is good for the program. Everyone here is well aware that it's better to be ranked at the end of the season than in November, so thank you for your enlightening statement. We've all grown just a little bit smarter thanks to you.
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Your mad because I said who cares if they are ranked in November? Hilarious.
 

scools12 said:
Your mad because I said who cares if they are ranked in November? Hilarious.
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Not mad at all. Just pointing out your ingenious statement. Thank you for it. In other news, the Rose Bowl is more prestigious than the Little Caesar's Bowl.
 

OSUfan said:
Memphis is not a win you should keep clinging to as a top-25 win. Yes, technically they were in the top-25, but they lost 2 games, one against a VCU team that went 1-2 in the tournament, and the Tigers weren't rated particularly highly to start with so they will almost certainly drop out of the top-25. Frankly, the Ohio Bobcats have more of a case for being snubbed by the rankings than the Gophers would - Sweet 16 last year, bring literally everybody back who played for them but unranked to start the season, and they dominated Richmond yesterday and are undefeated this year.

At this point in the season, there are probably 100 other teams with 0 or 1 losses. Have the Gophers really distinguished themselves to be among the top-25 of the 100 teams with similar records? I don't think so.
Click to expand...

If you look at Kentucky, their resume so far is basically identical to ours: They've beaten a few non-conference scrubs and an unranked BCS opponent, and lost to Duke at a neutral site, yet they are #8 in the country at the moment and will likely remain in the top 10 because they did not lose this week. They have accomplished about the same amount that we have, if anything the Gophers have done more because they have a win over a ranked opponent. Whether it's right or wrong though, Kentucky is currently the beneficiary of preseason rankings, they started the season ranked high, so as long as they beat the teams they should, which they have, and they only lose to good teams, in this case a top 10 ranked Duke team, they will hover right around where they started. They have done enough to maintain their ranking, but not enough to move up or down greatly. They are top 10 and the Gophers are unranked despite nearly identical resumes because they were ranked highly to begin with. The Gophers are relatively high up in the rankings, with respect to all of college basketball, so while they may not have accomplished anything more than Ohio has, they were ranked higher at the beginning of the week, which will give them an advantage over Ohio in getting into the top 25.

Also, #24 Baylor lost to Charleston last night, which should help us move up.
 

afurry91 said:
Not mad at all. Just pointing out your ingenious statement. Thank you for it. In other news, the Rose Bowl is more prestigious than the Little Caesar's Bowl.
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Being ranked in November and December then finishing 6-12 in conference is good for the program. Got it.
 

scools12 said:
Being ranked in November and December then finishing 6-12 in conference is good for the program. Got it.
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No one said that, you are assuming that we will struggle in the conference season. Stop making up arguments. Being ranked in November is definitely better than not being ranked in November.
 

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