This team will be better....when?

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akoch6767

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The trend of this team will be better next year has been the theme on this board for the past 3 years now. It is time to move on and find a new coach who actually gives a crap about his job. Tubby is earning 2M a year. We could pay someone 200K a year and probably get better results out of them. Tubby was clearly disinterested in his team tonight. Smith just sat on the bench and watched his team get creamed on their home court.

Let me ask you something...Remember how fun the team was to watch with Clem. The seats at Williams arena always full, Clem standing up for his team, and the whole crowd supported him...Well when we hired Tubby we thought he would bring that spark back to the barn. For a while he sure did, but now that sweet home court aroma with fans cheering for the Gophers at the top of their lungs, other teams getting rattled from all of the noise, and a coach who impacts his team is now gone.

Now the crowd is a lackluster bunch. Just watching the games only to leave with 5 minutes left on the clock in the second half to see their beloved gophers down by 15 points at the barn! A place in which the last 5 minutes of the game where every fan was on their feet not leaving the stadium, but cheering their butts of for the their team...

Tubby has lost the fans interest, and the interest of his players. You can say his team is just not very good this year, but that is a consistent trendy statement each and every year. The fact is that Smith brought these players in here, and promised he would help them improve. From what I have see he has done nothing to help them, and if he has well then the players he is recruiting are just not that good and never will be...

Same old same old year in and year out.

Lets put some fire back onto our home court and make a change for the better!
 

Better next week

Just my opinion. Would be nice to have Mo Walker playing though.
 

I really hope Mo will come back soon and healthy...Who knows...After tonight I have lost all hope on this team reaching the 9 or 10 conference wins needed to make the NCAA. If he comes back healthy with that sweet touch down low, and that big solid body for boxing out well and rebounding, maybe he is the missing link to this team...Although I think this team is light years away...Needing a few pure outside shooters, and a true big man, maybe Walker fits that roll in the future, but not right away imo.
 

Block M said:
Just my opinion. Would be nice to have Mo Walker playing though.
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I hope you are right. I am predicting that that the pressure from fans and media (which they deserve after this start) builds up and explodes for a good performance against Indiana. I think it will be an exciting one and won't be shocked if they pull off the upset.
 

akoch6767 said:
I really hope Mo will come back soon and healthy...Who knows...After tonight I have lost all hope on this team reaching the 9 or 10 conference wins needed to make the NCAA. If he comes back healthy with that sweet touch down low, and that big solid body for boxing out well and rebounding, maybe he is the missing link to this team...Although I think this team is light years away...Needing a few pure outside shooters, and a true big man, maybe Walker fits that roll in the future, but not right away imo.
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Good read on Huge Mo. Missing links are Huge Mo and time. Joe showed me tonight exactly what I was hoping to see.

Next time you go, ponder the jerseys on the wall. Most were not very good their freshmen year, several not even as sophomores.

Glad you're still going to the games. You will be rewarded. Took me 9 years to make to the it to the main floor.
 


I personally think Joe will be a conference POY candidate in the future. This kid has the hustle, determination, and I think he will develop the outside shot down the road to make a huge impact for this team. He has already proved he can some what lead this team. Let us hope this kid keeps his head in the game, and stays injury free! I think we have something special here.

Here is a lineup that may give us some hope...

C. Mo Walker---Big body, soft touch down low...Tractor Traylor??
F. Rodney Williams---Kid needs another year to prove to the NBA world he is worth their time.
F. Joe Coleman---Quickly learning how to play at this level. Scorer and slasher, and possibly a guy who is a lock for points at the charity stripe.
G. Austin Hollins---Face it, he is struggling, but his father is an NBA coach and the kid has shown upside at times...I look for improvement here.
G. Andre Hollins...Kid has some hops and quick hands as well as a good shot...Should improve if given more playing time under the right coach.

Welch could also start but it seems that Big Ten Play has gotten the best of him so far... This is no longer the JUCO lever with mediocre level talent...

Osenicks... Hmm this kid has a nice floater jump shot, and can be a versitile player on the wing with a three point shot, or posting up down low for a hook shot.

Andre Ingram---Big lanky body...Could play the 4 spot well if given more playing time...Gets into foul trouble, but he is a freshman and will learn.

The real question is will these guys be able to compete at the Big Ten Level consistently?

Also this team will lack a little depth in the future which will not help.
 

Oh duh...Chip Armelin...I like him coming off the Bench to ignite a spark in this team...Can play D...Very solid 6 man imo...probably will score in double figures.

Mav Ahanmisi...Do not like his D at all. Jackson lit him up all night. The guy is a streaky shooter. I really do not see him as more than a fill in once we see Andre Hollins improve.
 

akoch6767 said:
Andre Ingram---Big lanky body...Could play the 4 spot well if given more playing time...Gets into foul trouble, but he is a freshman and will learn.
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Andre Ingram is a Junior PF. Do you mean Elliot Elliason? Ingram does not get into foul trouble, he was only whistled once today. EE I think only had one foul today as well.
 

akoch6767 said:
Oh duh...Chip Armelin...I like him coming off the Bench to ignite a spark in this team...Can play D...Very solid 6 man imo...probably will score in double figures.

Mav Ahanmisi...Do not like his D at all. Jackson lit him up all night. The guy is a streaky shooter. I really do not see him as more than a fill in once we see Andre Hollins improve.
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In your two posts you pretty much nailed it, let me add several comments.

Ingram is a JUCO, I hope he can provide minutes next year. JUCO players often surprise in their second season.

In the Dutcher Era big men were brought in ever other year or so just like clockwork. Jimmy Williams would tutor them and they would become world beaters by their junior year. I played at a NAIA school with a SG drafted in the 3rd round by the Bulls, but never learned how to project backcourt players. With the perfect examples I was given over and over, I picked up some ability to project big men. First time I saw EE he immediately reminded me of Dutcher's stable of big men. No doubt in my mind he has an NBA future. In so many words, Bobby Knight said the same thing on a recent broadcast.
 



I would put it a 2 years from now to realisticly be in the top half of the big 10. I just don't see it this year at all anymore. Without Trevor we don't have a dominant force in the paint. Next year I don't think I can say Mo will be great after so much time off. I would think it will take until the following year for both EE and Mo to develop into good big men and players like coleman and andre to start to really shine and hopefully we won't have to guess who will be starting. We'll see though. Injuries/transfers could change things again.
 

Not a good sign when we're already talking about next year 4 games into the current Big Ten season.

I hope the guys we have coming back improve significantly the rest of this season because save for losing Ralph (and adding Mo & a couple recruits that don't project as significant impact) this is our team next season. And that assumes we don't lose anyone else for whatever reason(s).

And the B1G appears to be getting stronger (IU, Iowa & Michigan, not to mention the staples) not weaker.
 

howieramone said:
Good read on Huge Mo. Missing links are Huge Mo and time. Joe showed me tonight exactly what I was hoping to see.

Next time you go, ponder the jerseys on the wall. Most were not very good their freshmen year, several not even as sophomores.

Glad you're still going to the games. You will be rewarded. Took me 9 years to make to the it to the main floor.
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BS

Edit: Some played when frosh were not eligible. There also are some Gopher Greats w/o their jerseys on the wall that were damn good as frosh. Willie Burton? Vashon Leonard?
 

station19 said:
BS

Edit: Some played when frosh were not eligible. There also are some Gopher Greats w/o their jerseys on the wall that were damn good as frosh. Willie Burton? Vashon Leonard?
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Willie Burton was not very good as a frosh- showed a lot of talent but was not real good. Same with Newbern, as a prop 48 Sophomore. Turned the ball over regularly.

Leonard was very good as a Frosh as was Mark Olberding, Rickert and Humphries. Beyond those I can't recall a lot of instant stars.
 



CentralGopher said:
I would put it a 2 years from now to realisticly be in the top half of the big 10. I just don't see it this year at all anymore. Without Trevor we don't have a dominant force in the paint. Next year I don't think I can say Mo will be great after so much time off. I would think it will take until the following year for both EE and Mo to develop into good big men and players like coleman and andre to start to really shine and hopefully we won't have to guess who will be starting. We'll see though. Injuries/transfers could change things again.
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at least until 2014 and I wouldn'y say top half of the B1G but 2 years back to .500 in the conference and that is going to require recruiting an impact freshman. amazing how far the program has fallen since the Michigan road win last year.
 

bga1 said:
Willie Burton was not very good as a frosh- showed a lot of talent but was not real good. Same with Newbern, as a prop 48 Sophomore. Turned the ball over regularly.

Leonard was very good as a Frosh as was Mark Olberding, Rickert and Humphries. Beyond those I can't recall a lot of instant stars.
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Here is the quote that was replied to:

Next time you go, ponder the jerseys on the wall. Most were not very good their freshmen year, several not even as sophomores.

How about Hudson, Clark, Yates and Kunze. They couldn't play as frosh but were all big time players as sophs. McHale and Thompson were both more that 'not very good' as sophs.

I could go on but won't. The idea that Gopher players haven't been very good, or shouldn't be expected to, until their jr. year is BS.
 

Some of the most impactful freshman (point-wise) that I can find info on:

Burton: 8.7 ppg
Coffey: 6.9
Sam Jacobson: 7.7
Lenard: 12.8
Q Lewis: 6.7
Olberding: 16
Mychal Thompson: 12.5
McHale: 12.0
Humphries: 21.7
Tarver: 0.3
Rickert: 15
Randy Carter: I don't have average, but I know he went for 29 and 14 against Northwestern
Breuer: 7.7
Tucker: 9.9
Mitchell: 7.8
Mark Hall: 8.5
 

Seems as if I forgot about a few players last night.

howieramone you really have a good projection of Ingram's development. I actually had no idea he was a JUCO player. This sort of bums me out, and I just hope he can contribute more this season, and not turn out to be a Devron Bostick type.

I personally am on the fence with Eliason. We have seen the good and the bad with him this year. Yes the fouls are immense with him because his defense on the Big Ten big guys is horrific. Eliason has to learn how to use his big 7 foot body better. When I watched him play against Va Tech I saw a guy who used it very well. Instead of reaching, and leaning into guys, I saw a guy who kept his hands up and his body straight up to frustrate the opposing team. He has to get back to that style of defense to become a solid level Big Ten player.

Luckily EE is a redshirted freshman, and he still has 4 years to develop. I would like to see him develop beyond a Spencer Tollackson or Colton Iverson type player.
 

Good summary. The amazing part with Tucker's PPG is that there was no 3 point line when he played.
 

akoch6767 said:
Seems as if I forgot about a few players last night.

howieramone you really have a good projection of Ingram's development. I actually had no idea he was a JUCO player. This sort of bums me out, and I just hope he can contribute more this season, and not turn out to be a Devron Bostick type.I personally am on the fence with Eliason. We have seen the good and the bad with him this year. Yes the fouls are immense with him because his defense on the Big Ten big guys is horrific. Eliason has to learn how to use his big 7 foot body better. When I watched him play against Va Tech I saw a guy who used it very well. Instead of reaching, and leaning into guys, I saw a guy who kept his hands up and his body straight up to frustrate the opposing team. He has to get back to that style of defense to become a solid level Big Ten player.

Luckily EE is a redshirted freshman, and he still has 4 years to develop. I would like to see him develop beyond a Spencer Tollackson or Colton Iverson type player.
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The only way Ingram makes an impact next year is if he comes back with a body like J'son Stamper. This is a physical league and a 6'6" power forward has got to be a beast.

As far as Bostick - I would have thought by now that people would have gotten it. Kid had a ton of ability and got Tubbied. I know he hit the evil weed, but that appears to be the drug of choice for those that cannot figure out the Tubby schemes.
 

bga1 said:
As far as Bostick - I would have thought by now that people would have gotten it. Kid had a ton of ability and got Tubbied. I know he hit the evil weed, but that appears to be the drug of choice for those that cannot figure out the Tubby schemes.
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+1. Despite being buried for during his senior year, he was always one of the biggest cheerleaders on the sidelines
 

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