gopher recruiting ranked 12th in Big Ten

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Stan

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I know Rivals and Scout are a sham but we're currently ranked 12th out of 12 in the Rivals conference recruiting rankings. I'm not sure if this will change a lot as other schools catch up to us in the # of verbals or not. But are we still confident that Kill will coach 'em up and that these guys are all football players like he likes to say? I'm not a recruit-nik type so I don't know and am asking for honest assessment especially since its obvious that guys will transfer out. Here are current rankings >> http://rivals.yahoo.com/footballrecruiting/football/recruiting/teamrank/2012/BIG10/all <<
 


Stan said:
I know Rivals and Scout are a sham but we're currently ranked 12th out of 12 in the Rivals conference recruiting rankings. I'm not sure if this will change a lot as other schools catch up to us in the # of verbals or not. But are we still confident that Kill will coach 'em up and that these guys are all football players like he likes to say? I'm not a recruit-nik type so I don't know and am asking for honest assessment especially since its obvious that guys will transfer out. Here are current rankings >> http://rivals.yahoo.com/footballrecruiting/football/recruiting/teamrank/2012/BIG10/all <<
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Too early to tell. All the usual suspects (IU, NW, ILL, Pur, MN) are close enough that you'd need to have the whole classes in just to do the math precisely enough. However, with ILL looking better I would guess they will get a bump.
 

recruiting

Well if we are indeed going to bring in the worst recruiting class in the conference I am not sure how Kill's excuses of not having enough talent to win will fix any of our problems. He can't have it both ways.

Either he recruits above average talent or better start "coaching them up". I am ok with this hire (much like I was a Brewster kool-aid drinker for over 3 years) but I can't be sold on him until HIS team shows improvement in effort and intelligence on the field.
 

We have 4-5 4 stars on our team right now, and our best players, Cobb, Moulton, Shortell... are 2-3 stars, and not Brew's 'top talent 4 star' recruits
 


Cobb, Moulton, and Shortell are our best players? Not even close. Stoudermire, McKnight, Tinsley, Gray, Lair(one guy you can certainly say is not being used correctly) are all better players.

Even if you don't "believe" in recruiting rankings (which is just silly if you "believe" in statistics), Kill claimed that he was going to recruit speed. If you look at the current list of athletes committed, the Gophers don't have much speed signed up at all. Kill has done a solid job keeping the in state kids home, and it would qualify as a good job if he lands Will Johnson. Will have to see what the class looks like on signing day, but so far my fears of going back to the days of bottom of the barrell recruiting classes look to be realized. I think it is important to note that Brewster's recruiting tailed off as he failed to win/receive an extension. If people want to talk about the talent on this year's team, it is hard to imagine it getting better next year. The one exception is the Oline where I do think we have some talent, they just aren't physically mature yet. Olson, Gjere, Olson, McAvoy, McAvoy, possibly Ferguson, possibly Campion, will all greatly benefit from another year of lifting and eating.
 


EG#9 said:
Cobb, Moulton, and Shortell are our best players? Not even close. Stoudermire, McKnight, Tinsley, Gray, Lair(one guy you can certainly say is not being used correctly) are all better players.

Even if you don't "believe" in recruiting rankings (which is just silly if you "believe" in statistics), Kill claimed that he was going to recruit speed. If you look at the current list of athletes committed, the Gophers don't have much speed signed up at all. Kill has done a solid job keeping the in state kids home, and it would qualify as a good job if he lands Will Johnson. Will have to see what the class looks like on signing day, but so far my fears of going back to the days of bottom of the barrell recruiting classes look to be realized. I think it is important to note that Brewster's recruiting tailed off as he failed to win/receive an extension. If people want to talk about the talent on this year's team, it is hard to imagine it getting better next year. The one exception is the Oline where I do think we have some talent, they just aren't physically mature yet. Olson, Gjere, Olson, McAvoy, McAvoy, possibly Ferguson, possibly Campion, will all greatly benefit from another year of lifting and eating.
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Next years team is going to be bad, defensively as bad as they are this year they lose alot of the key players. If there is any uptick with Kill it will start in year 3 at the earliest. Time will tell, I hope we don't have a complete cave in this year, back to Wacker years if that is the case.
 

So because Rivals isn't friendly to the Gophers it is somehow a sham?

Doh'kay:D
 



Recruiting rankings are an indicator that has a positive correlation with on-field success. They are not an indicator of anything certain.

If you consistently recruit well according to the rankings, it is not certain that you will succeed.

If you consistently recruit poorly according to the rankings, it is not certain that you will fail.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Recruiting rankings are an indicator that has a positive correlation with on-field success. They are not an indicator of anything certain.

If you consistently recruit well according to the rankings, it is not certain that you will succeed.

If you consistently recruit poorly according to the rankings, it is not certain that you will fail.
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Exactly, these recruiting sites are an inexact science; however, they are a fairly good indicator of success. As with everything, there are exceptions.
 

If you recall there were quite a few of Brewsters recruits we were excited for based on some unrealistic "yellow stars" on a few different websites and we all know how that worked out. I'm always amused on how different recruiting sites can have such varied opinions on these kids...often times boards like this hang onto whichever site is more optimistic. In this case Yahoo wouldn't be one of them. As always you not only have to get good kids, but you have to coach them up. A year from now if we are still having games like Saturday we'll know if Jerry and do either.
 

The diamonds in the rough don't come along that often.

Mason had a few with Barber, Setterstrom, Eslinger. etc. Except for a few exceptions the teams that are continously in the top 25
have top 25-30 classes. If you've a 4-5 star kid in Minnesota you need to keep him because they're usually only 3 or 4 on the average per year over a ten year period. This is where Wisconsin has done a great job. They keep the top kids at home and balance it with national recruits. Kill cannot bring the Gophers to the next level above the Mason years with 12th ranked classes in the BIG. That is like entering the Kentucky Derby each year with a Clydesdale.
 



19 Commits

The Gophers have 19 commits and that's a good thing for the most part. Troublesome is that the teams ahead of them only have 8-14 commits so they team rankings are likely to jump considerably. The column to keep close tabs on is the average stars. That, to me, is the best measure of a recruiting class.

Phillip Nelson looks the part and it appears there is a solid nucleus for the class. Coach Kill will be selling playing time, and while the class will likely be ranked low in the Big Ten, it should help build the program for years 3 and 4.

Good luck this season, except against the Illini!
 

Recruiting obviously matters but I really think we need to walk before we run. Our program is in shambles and I am 100% cool with Kill recruiting classes of guys who have less academic question marks, who are more sold on "being here" and who he thinks fit our system. We need to become just a "less than average" Big 10 team before we start worrying about if we have the guns to compete with the best in the Big 10. Right now, we are middle of the road MAC (maybe).

I have no idea if that's what is happening with our recruiting. However, i'd take 2-3 classes in a row like that class if they stayed in school over a more publicisized class that is crippled by attrition.
 

There are actually 21 commits. The rankings list shows 19 because two of them (Barrington Morris and Tyren Hills) have not yet been evaluated.
 

If you are the worst team in the conference, and is in the running for being one of the worst in the country for the second year in a row, I am not sure how we can hold any expectations on recruiting. Brewster pulled off a miracle his first year, yes, but that's just not normal. Not only that, half of those guys aren't even here anymore. Kill's gonna have to do the "coach 'em up" thing and have a little bit of success before he can start to try to net some of the 4-star kids most likely. If we can challenge for a bowl game next year, show an upward trend, it'll help matters.
 

this class looks to be a bit above our average and well above a few of mason's

if we're the bottom, then the b1g may be doing better this year

not as good as brew's first two classes, but ok. if all our 3*s are like pirsig, this could develop into a very good squad in a few years.

the quality of this class is far from my top concerns with gopher football
 

I don't know how well this years class will be...time will tell. I do know that Kill brought in a couple of late recruits after his hire in Marcus Jones and Maufala and they are both performing well in his system as true FR...so maybe the guy didn't accidently win everyplace he has coached...but again, time will tell.

My bigger concern is Kill stating 10-12 kids are at risk academically...if we can't keep our kids in school...all the recruiting in the world wont matter...we can't win with a team made up of 80% first and second kids.
 

Very encouraging that in a 58-0 loss the bright spot is a Kill recruit and freshman Jones. I am not worried about his recruiting at all. We are going to recruit in the bottom 3rd of the league bases on perception alone.
 

Yep, the bright spots on the season so far have been Shortell (a Brew guy, I know), Marcus Jones, Cobb, Amaefula and Moulton.

Jones, Cobb, Amaefula and Moulton were all late guys who didn't receive a lot of recruiting attention, but they are probably the most exciting younger players on this team.

With recruiting, you can't judge it until the players play.
 

There is no way a coach should realistically be able to get better players than Kill has to go to Minnesota. It is not somewhere most people want to play.
 

Find me a coach at a program like Minnesota, Iowa, or Wisconsin who can "coach up" 2 and 3-star guys and I'll guarantee you have a successful coach. From the Scout 2009 rankings of UW's class, the following 2 or 3-star guys are playing major roles for UW this year:

TE Jacob Pedersen (2 stars)
SS Dez Southward (2 stars)
DE Pat Muldoon
DE David Gilbert
OG Travis Frederick (2 stars)
MLB Chris Borland (2 stars)
RB Montee Ball
DT Jordan Kohout

All of these guys are starters, save Muldoon who is a key part of the DE rotation. There are another 4 or 5 guys in that class who are in the 2-deep and get playing time that were 2 or 3-star guys. You can win with that talent as long as your coaches are good evaluators and are bringing in guys that fit your system and are willing to work.
 

Radio Badger said:
Find me a coach at a program like Minnesota, Iowa, or Wisconsin who can "coach up" 2 and 3-star guys and I'll guarantee you have a successful coach. From the Scout 2009 rankings of UW's class, the following 2 or 3-star guys are playing major roles for UW this year:

TE Jacob Pedersen (2 stars)
SS Dez Southward (2 stars)
DE Pat Muldoon
DE David Gilbert
OG Travis Frederick (2 stars)
MLB Chris Borland (2 stars)
RB Montee Ball
DT Jordan Kohout

All of these guys are starters, save Muldoon who is a key part of the DE rotation. There are another 4 or 5 guys in that class who are in the 2-deep and get playing time that were 2 or 3-star guys. You can win with that talent as long as your coaches are good evaluators and are bringing in guys that fit your system and are willing to work.
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Don't forget Russell Wilson being a 2 star coming out of HS. I know Sconny didn't really develop him, but yeah...

I see your point, but that happens just about everywhere, even with lousy coaches. We have examples with Decker, McKnight, Willie, etc. Don't get me wrong, it's a completely vital part of building a program. However, the most important thing for us (IMO) is to try to ensure that we retain the players that we actually recruit. But it sort of goes hand in hand with your idea. I just don't really even think it takes a ton of great coaching to make it happen. Experience in a system does wonders for players who aren't the most athletic guys in the world.

Take Ryan Collado for example. Has there ever been a player who looked less ready to contribute in the Big 10 than Collado after his 1st year? 4 years later he wasn't a good Big 10 player, but he was definitely serviceable and found a niche on our team. Guys like Collado shouldn't be the rare of example of a kid coming on and showing he can play a bit in his SR/JR seasons, it should our norm.
 


I'm really not worried about Kill's recruiting at this point, the guys he has targeted in a shortened recruiting season from 2011 have proven their worth in year 1. He's going to stockpile athletes that fit his desired profile, and put them in places the staff thinks they can succeed.
BTW it's not like he's got a horrible class going even according to the star chasers, plenty of 3 stars, ESPN thinks highly of a few of these kids, Hayes, Harbison, Pirsig are all 4 stars somewhere if you're into that type of thing.
We'll see how they look in 3 years.

Edit for the bison troll: Johnson's a big kid, but our numbers are not in favor of him earning an offer, he's a nice local prospect but not up to Pirsig or Hayes' level, and I doubt we take any more OL in this class.
 

I don't really care as much where the Gophers rank I am way more concerned they stay in school!
 

Vitojr130 said:
http://www.inforum.com/event/article/id/336099/

He sounds like a big guy. Could be a great home-state recruit for...oh wait... Yup. The Bison.
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I don't follow high school football, but a guy weighing 310 in high school, even at 6-5, would indicate a possible weight problem. Strength and foot speed could be lacking, and that could be why he didn't get any FBS offers.
 

This is from the weekly notes for this weeks game.

With the school year now under way, Minnesota has added numerous players to its roster. The roster now includes 119 student-athletes. Of those 119 players, 78 of them (65.5 percent) are either true freshmen, red-shirt freshmen or sophomores. The Gophers are only carrying 41 upperclassmen on the roster. Here’s the full breakdown of each class for the Gophers: Freshmen - 53; Sophomores - 25; Juniors - 21; Seniors - 20.

So there are 12 guys that were not on the camp roster, now on the team. Wonder if any of these guys have any talent. Also here is the class breakdown.
 


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