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Ghost of Bruce Smith
11-23-2008, 07:18 PM
I can't believe we have to go through this again. I also can't believe how many of you are ready to throw Brewster under the bus. Let's take a look at a little history:

Barry Alvarez:

1990 ... 1-10
1991 ... 5-6
1992 ... 5-6
1994 ... 10-1 (Rose Bowl)

Gary Barnett (at Northwestern):

1992 ... 3-8
1993 ... 2-9
1994 ... 3-7-1
1995 ... 10-2 (Rose Bowl)

Ron Zook:

2005 ... 2-10
2006 ... 2-10
2007 ... 8-4 (Rose Bowl)

And now let's take a look at Reusse's favorite head coach, Kirk Ferentz:

1999 ... 1-10
2000 ... 3-9
2001 ... 7-5
2002 ... 11-2 (Orange Bowl)

A closer look at Ferentz's 2nd season reveals a 31-0 drubbing at the hands of Illinois. 55-0? No, but embarrassing enough where I'm sure Iowa City and Des Moines columnists were calling for his head.

The point of this history lesson is that it usually takes about 4 years for a new coach's recruits to finally reach the promised land of a January bowl. And we all know that Brewster can recruit. It is absolutely stunning that Reusse won't give Brewster's recruits time to mature before passing judgment. Apparently he is too busy giving Ferentz a virtual thigh massage (a little higher Mr. Ferentz?).

The future is bright. The curse of the Metrodome is gone. The OL will be better. One year more experienced and the addition of Carufel will be huge. The receivers of Decker, Green, Hayo, and hopefully McNeal should be better and really exciting to watch. With proper protection Weber will be fine, and Gray and Pittman should be able provide able backup. Our defense will be one more year experienced, and our running game will be better with the return of Duane Bennett (plus the depth provided by Shady, Eskeridge, Lipscomb, and Whaley).

And we'll be watching all of this in TCF Bank Stadium. Are you kidding me? Who isn't excited about this?

Like this year compared to the 1-11 of last year, next year should be better. And the next year should be even better. Give Brewster 4 years. He has proven he can recruit. He has improved the team over last year. And the future is looking very bright.

gophermartin
11-23-2008, 07:49 PM
...yes it was embarassing...but Brewster and staff and team will rise above that and continue to stay on target and on plan.

Recruit recruit recruit!

ANd win the bowl game.

Great data for perspective.

GM

Art Vandelay
11-23-2008, 09:20 PM
None of the coaches mentioned above was a no name TE coach in the NFL that inherited a program that went to a bowl game the previous year (and 5 out of 6). The only reason 7-5 is without question so tremendously outstanding is because the guy just had the "losingest" season in the program's 100+ year history. This team shouldn't lose 55-0 to the Giants...

MRJ
11-23-2008, 09:25 PM
I gotta admit, I agree with Art on this one.

No matter the talent deficit, you should never lose to a rival by 55 points.

But unlike some others, I'm willing to give Brewster some time. There were significant improvements from a team that went 1-11 in my eyes due to a complete transition from systems under Mason.

Whether we actually reach the higher ceiling under Brewster that we're all hoping for remains to be seen. And to be honest, we probably won't know for a couple more years yet.

Schnoodler
11-23-2008, 10:02 PM
None of the coaches mentioned above was a no name TE coach in the NFL that inherited a program that went to a bowl game the previous year (and 5 out of 6). The only reason 7-5 is without question so tremendously outstanding is because the guy just had the "losingest" season in the program's 100+ year history. This team shouldn't lose 55-0 to the Giants...

Irrelevent Art. Different system, doesn't transfer. Same problem Michigan faced this year.

whine all you want, mason isn't coming back.

btowngopher
11-24-2008, 09:21 AM
None of the coaches mentioned above was a no name TE coach in the NFL that inherited a program that went to a bowl game the previous year (and 5 out of 6). The only reason 7-5 is without question so tremendously outstanding is because the guy just had the "losingest" season in the program's 100+ year history. This team shouldn't lose 55-0 to the Giants...

so what do you want? fire brewster? can you name me some talent mason left for brewster?

Gold Vision
11-24-2008, 09:29 AM
so what do you want? fire brewster? can you name me some talent mason left for brewster?

WVDS, Decker, Lee Cambell, Weber, Simmons.

I'm a Brewster backer, but there are some nice pieces on this team that shouldn't lead to a 55-0 drubbing by Iowa at home. I put more of the blame on Dunbar than Brewster, but in no way can either coach be thrown under the bus this early.

Schnoodler
11-24-2008, 09:40 AM
I'd be more worried about a coach that changed their scheme so we didn't get beat as bad than I am with the committment Brew and Dunbar have to their current scheme. We know what the problem is. It's fixable, many other programs can block in this system. Dunbar, has succeeded in this system. It requires skill and experience. We will add Carufel to the mix, the entire line will be back with another year of ex, and we'll add some new blood for the future. We just need to give it time. They'll work it out.

McGopherFan
11-24-2008, 09:42 AM
The offense that was installed needs some serious tweeking. IF Dunbar cannot get that done by the end of next season, Brewster needs to find someone who can. If he does not and the solution is not apparent at the end of the 2009 season - Maturi will seriously need to consider moving in the direction of a new headcoach.

Thus far interms of coaching ability, the new guy, Roof is the only one that provided improvement and growth this year. If he had not the Wisconsin game would have been in the 50 point range too. There is something to be said about this defense. Maybe Brewster lucked into Roof, but the defense has improved there is no doubt.

Even with the 55 point deficite in Saturdays game, with the offense leaving the defense to twist in the wind (TOP difference of 15 minutes???), and one turnover returned for a touchdown, the responsibility for number of points put up by Iowa has to be shared at least evenly by the offense.


WVDS, Decker, Lee Cambell, Weber, Simmons.

I'm a Brewster backer, but there are some nice pieces on this team that shouldn't lead to a 55-0 drubbing by Iowa at home. I put more of the blame on Dunbar than Brewster, but in no way can either coach be thrown under the bus this early.

monk10
11-24-2008, 09:47 AM
Only one more game with Simmons blocking (holding, clipping, etc) at the point of attack. That will be an improvement next year.

Schnoodler
11-24-2008, 09:48 AM
The offense that was installed needs some serious tweeking. IF Dunbar cannot get that done by the end of next season, Brewster needs to find someone who can. If he does not and the solution is not apparent at the end of the 2009 season - Maturi will seriously need to consider moving in the direction of a new headcoach.

Thus far interms of coaching ability, the new guy, Roof is the only one that provided improvement and growth this year. If he had not the Wisconsin game would have been in the 50 point range too. There is something to be said about this defense. Maybe Brewster lucked into Roof, but the defense has improved there is no doubt.

Even with the 55 point deficite in Saturdays game, with the offense leaving the defense to twist in the wind (TOP difference of 15 minutes???), and one turnover returned for a touchdown, the responsibility for number of points put up by Iowa has to be shared at least evenly by the offense.


I'll put it all on the offense. The D was tough and being young probably was demoralized a little too early. You saw them wearing down by the end of the first half.

Am I the only one that has noticed that our front four have become sort of monster like as the seasons gone on. Nobody runs through that. They can still go around, they can catch us in over pursuit, but they can't go through.

50PoundHead
11-24-2008, 12:06 PM
By all accounts, Dunbar is extremely stubbon and Saturday night was a prime example of why he has to be more flexible. It's hard when your line is young and you don't have a feature-level talent running back, but it's fairly obvious that in the last month, teams basically played with eight or nine in the box and jumped every underneath pattern. Weber didn't have time to go deep and if you are gonig to run the spread successfully, you have to prevent a defense for going "forward" consistently without suffering consequences.

Here's hoping for better next season. Hopefully Green and Smith and others (particularly Carpenter) can get down the field to open up the underneath stuff.

Did Lair red-shirt?

But, going back to the main point of the thread, I'm with Ghost 100%. Mason's teams were pretty much committed to mediocrity. Some great players, but never a solid defense (regardless if it was Gibbs or Lockwood jumping around on the sidelines) and never much depth. Every year we seemed to be re-building one place or another.

WolfontheProwl
11-24-2008, 01:39 PM
Plain and simple if you dont have a line playing well you are not going to have a good offense. The Line fell apart as the season went along some of that had to do with injuries and the other part youth and inexperience. Another year under their belt and the additional new players is only going to help this unit improve which will improve the entire offense. The one problem that Gophers have had this season is the lack of a good blocking TE Simmons and Tow Arnett are more pass catchers IMO and we were relying on young RBs after Bennett was lost and some of the hardest things to learn for RBs is blitz pickup. A good blocking TE and an RB with experience in blocking sure could have helped this year taking pressure off the line. Hageman sure looks like a TE that will be able to help out the line both run and pass blocking. Rome was not built in a day and great programs are built over years not just one recruiting class or two seasons of play.

grunkiejr
11-24-2008, 02:07 PM
nt

grunkiejr
11-24-2008, 02:11 PM
By all accounts, Dunbar is extremely stubbon and Saturday night was a prime example of why he has to be more flexible. It's hard when your line is young and you don't have a feature-level talent running back, but it's fairly obvious that in the last month, teams basically played with eight or nine in the box and jumped every underneath pattern. Weber didn't have time to go deep and if you are gonig to run the spread successfully, you have to prevent a defense for going "forward" consistently without suffering consequences.

Here's hoping for better next season. Hopefully Green and Smith and others (particularly Carpenter) can get down the field to open up the underneath stuff.

Did Lair red-shirt?

But, going back to the main point of the thread, I'm with Ghost 100%. Mason's teams were pretty much committed to mediocrity. Some great players, but never a solid defense (regardless if it was Gibbs or Lockwood jumping around on the sidelines) and never much depth. Every year we seemed to be re-building one place or another.


I saw Lair playing on special teams a few times this season so I don't think he redshirted.

It will be interesting to see where Hageman and Gregory-Mcghee are next year versus Lair and how playing time is split up for the #2 TE behind Tow-Arnett.

Physically, I don't think Gregory-Mcghee is going to be strong enough to play next year (he looks like a oversized WR that needs to add bulk). It wouldn't surprise me if he moves over to LB either because his frame is adequate for LB. I could envision him as a 6'4" 230 lb SLB. Right now he is only 214 lbs which isn't big enough to play TE or DE in the Big Ten and for a 6'4" it is light for LB.

Lair is listed at 210 so hopefully he adds 20 lbs in the offseason because even 230 would be light for a Big Ten TE. That might be aggressive but 15 lbs should be seen as the minimum weight gain for him to see the field when we need to run the ball.

Hageman is tall and lanky but I think he may be the most physically ready to see the field. He is listed at 6'6" 250 which already puts him at the playing weight for Tow-Arnett & Simmons. Personally, I think he looks lighter than his listed weight. With height and frame 260 or even 270 may be an ideal weight for him.

The Big L
11-24-2008, 02:13 PM
I saw Lair playing on special teams a few times this season so I don't think he redshirted.

It will be interesting to see where Hageman and Gregory-Mcghee are next year versus Lair and how playing time is split up for the #2 TE behind Tow-Arnett.

Physically, I don't think Gregory-Mcghee is going to be strong enough to play next year (he looks like a oversized WR that needs to add bulk). It wouldn't surprise me if he moves over to LB either because his frame is adequate for LB. I could envision him as a 6'4" 230 lb SLB. Right now he is only 214 lbs which isn't big enough to play TE or DE in the Big Ten and for a 6'4" it is light for LB.

Lair is listed at 210 so hopefully he adds 20 lbs in the offseason because even 230 would be light for a Big Ten TE. That might be aggressive but 15 lbs should be seen as the minimum weight gain for him to see the field when we need to run the ball.

Hageman is tall and lanky but I think he may be the most physically ready to see the field. He is listed at 6'6" 250 which already puts him at the playing weight for Tow-Arnett & Simmons. Personally, I think he looks lighter than his listed weight. With height and frame 260 or even 270 may be an ideal weight for him.

I was under the impression that, since we got Hageman, Gregory-Mcghee was going to be used on the defensive side of the ball. I've seen him listed as a potential DE, but I agree his size is a concern.

I expect to see Tow-Arnett and Hageman as our top 2 TE next year.

btowngopher
11-24-2008, 09:30 PM
WVDS, Decker, Lee Cambell, Weber, Simmons.

I'm a Brewster backer, but there are some nice pieces on this team that shouldn't lead to a 55-0 drubbing by Iowa at home. I put more of the blame on Dunbar than Brewster, but in no way can either coach be thrown under the bus this early.

Weber=no experience when Brewster got him, he still has 2 more years to improve. He is a talent, but was in no way ready to step in when Brewster took over. Problem was Mason didn't really leave anyone else who was ready.
WVDS=Banged up Brewster's entire first year.
Lee Campbell=Brewster and Roof put him back at LB and he was decent, far from a great talent though. He wouldn't start for most big10 teams.
Simmons=Can catch but can't block, and isn't amazing as a pass catcher.
Decker=Good talent, would not get the recognition in a mason offense though.

Even if you consider these all good talents its still only FIVE guys! How can you be good with only one real recruiting class when all you have is 5 guys left to you??? Hell I am happy to be 7-5 regardless of the last 4 games.

GophersInIowa
11-25-2008, 09:52 AM
I was under the impression that, since we got Hageman, Gregory-Mcghee was going to be used on the defensive side of the ball. I've seen him listed as a potential DE, but I agree his size is a concern.

I expect to see Tow-Arnett and Hageman as our top 2 TE next year.

It's fairly easy for a player to put on 30+ pounds in his first year of college, especially if he is redshirted. I'm only 5'8" and put on 15 pounds in about 3 months during the off-season my freshman year.

50PoundHead
11-25-2008, 10:19 AM
I saw Lair playing on special teams a few times this season so I don't think he redshirted.

It will be interesting to see where Hageman and Gregory-Mcghee are next year versus Lair and how playing time is split up for the #2 TE behind Tow-Arnett.

Physically, I don't think Gregory-Mcghee is going to be strong enough to play next year (he looks like a oversized WR that needs to add bulk). It wouldn't surprise me if he moves over to LB either because his frame is adequate for LB. I could envision him as a 6'4" 230 lb SLB. Right now he is only 214 lbs which isn't big enough to play TE or DE in the Big Ten and for a 6'4" it is light for LB.

Lair is listed at 210 so hopefully he adds 20 lbs in the offseason because even 230 would be light for a Big Ten TE. That might be aggressive but 15 lbs should be seen as the minimum weight gain for him to see the field when we need to run the ball.

Hageman is tall and lanky but I think he may be the most physically ready to see the field. He is listed at 6'6" 250 which already puts him at the playing weight for Tow-Arnett & Simmons. Personally, I think he looks lighter than his listed weight. With height and frame 260 or even 270 may be an ideal weight for him.

Thanks for the clarification on Lair. Gregory-Mcghee has been listed as an "athlete" on Rivals, so my guess is he'll red-shirt and they'll try to determine his best position though his freshman year.

tjgopher
11-25-2008, 10:44 AM
None of the coaches mentioned above was a no name TE coach in the NFL that inherited a program that went to a bowl game the previous year (and 5 out of 6). The only reason 7-5 is without question so tremendously outstanding is because the guy just had the "losingest" season in the program's 100+ year history. This team shouldn't lose 55-0 to the Giants...

Although Ferentz was a no-name offensive line coach in the NFL who inherited a program that had gone to bowl games in 14 of the previous 17 years, including three Big Ten titles. And, in fact, he inherited a team that was two years removed from being ranked in the Top Ten.

Yet, he won four games in his first two years. Like Brewster, Ferentz was never a coordinator at the NCAA Div I or the NFL level before he was hired at Iowa as the head coach. Although he did serve a two-year stint as head coach at Maine (in which he was sub .500). And, like Brewster, Ferentz was a relative unknown, even to the people of Iowa when he was hired. Certainly, no one in Minnesota had ever heard of the guy when the Hawkeyes hired him.

bigtenchamps1899
11-25-2008, 10:55 AM
I can't believe we have to go through this again. I also can't believe how many of you are ready to throw Brewster under the bus. Let's take a look at a little history:

Barry Alvarez:

1990 ... 1-10
1991 ... 5-6
1992 ... 5-6
1994 ... 10-1 (Rose Bowl)

Gary Barnett (at Northwestern):

1992 ... 3-8
1993 ... 2-9
1994 ... 3-7-1
1995 ... 10-2 (Rose Bowl)

Ron Zook:

2005 ... 2-10
2006 ... 2-10
2007 ... 8-4 (Rose Bowl)

And now let's take a look at Reusse's favorite head coach, Kirk Ferentz:

1999 ... 1-10
2000 ... 3-9
2001 ... 7-5
2002 ... 11-2 (Orange Bowl)

A closer look at Ferentz's 2nd season reveals a 31-0 drubbing at the hands of Illinois. 55-0? No, but embarrassing enough where I'm sure Iowa City and Des Moines columnists were calling for his head.

The point of this history lesson is that it usually takes about 4 years for a new coach's recruits to finally reach the promised land of a January bowl. And we all know that Brewster can recruit. It is absolutely stunning that Reusse won't give Brewster's recruits time to mature before passing judgment. Apparently he is too busy giving Ferentz a virtual thigh massage (a little higher Mr. Ferentz?).

The future is bright. The curse of the Metrodome is gone. The OL will be better. One year more experienced and the addition of Carufel will be huge. The receivers of Decker, Green, Hayo, and hopefully McNeal should be better and really exciting to watch. With proper protection Weber will be fine, and Gray and Pittman should be able provide able backup. Our defense will be one more year experienced, and our running game will be better with the return of Duane Bennett (plus the depth provided by Shady, Eskeridge, Lipscomb, and Whaley).

And we'll be watching all of this in TCF Bank Stadium. Are you kidding me? Who isn't excited about this?

Like this year compared to the 1-11 of last year, next year should be better. And the next year should be even better. Give Brewster 4 years. He has proven he can recruit. He has improved the team over last year. And the future is looking very bright.

pat fitzgerald did not have a terrible first year but at 4-8 with a loss to new hampshire, it was not good by any means, 2007 he went 6-6, 2008 he is 9-3 with a losses to #23 msu and #11 osu (and a fluke loss to ind).

StPaulHawkeye
11-25-2008, 12:33 PM
I was interested, so just for perspective, here is the previous three years before the new coach took over...

Wisconsin
Don Morton:
1987 3-8
1988 1-10
1989 2-9
Barry Alvarez:
1990 ... 1-10
1991 ... 5-6
1992 ... 5-6
1994 ... 10-1 (Rose Bowl)

Northwestern
Francis Peay:
1989 0-11
1990 2-9
1991 3-8
Gary Barnett:
1992 ... 3-8
1993 ... 2-9
1994 ... 3-7-1
1995 ... 10-2 (Rose Bowl)

Illinois
Ron Turner:
2002 5-7
2003 1-11
2004 3-8
Ron Zook:
2005 ... 2-10
2006 ... 2-10
2007 ... 8-4 (Rose Bowl)

Iowa
Hayden Fry:
1996 8-3 (Alamo Bowl)
1997 7-4 (Sun Bowl)
1998 3-8
Kirk Ferentz:
1999 ... 1-10
2000 ... 3-9
2001 ... 7-5
2002 ... 11-2 (Orange Bowl)

Minnesota
Glen Mason:
2004 7-5 (Music City Bowl)
2005 7-5 (Music City Bowl)
2006 6-7 (Insight Bowl)
Tim Brewster:
2007 1-11
2008 7-5 (so far)

harrys ghost
11-25-2008, 12:49 PM
What about Michigan going to a spread offense?

Lloyd Carr
2005 7-5
2006 11-2
2007 9-4

Rich Rodriquez
2008 3-9