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View Full Version : Bush, Obama and these times



bga1
12-29-2009, 09:43 AM
As we look back on this last ten years one has to pause and imagine how difficult it must be to be President of the United States. We live in rapidly changing times.

Over just the past 30 years we have seen:

The economy has gone global in the interest of low cost labor. The entire US economy has changed from a manufacturing based economy to a service economy. Many, without an education or skills, suffer. A stubborn, union mentality exacerbates the problem. The world moves on without them. For the large part we don't make TVs, clothing, shoes or other basics here any more. Cars may be next.

The violent rise of radical Islam spread beyond it's traditional borders to have global influence.

A huge change in the cultural diversity of our population. The new immigrants wish to have a piece of the American wealth but often they have no goal to assimilate into our society. This has created a larger percentage that need to be served with different languages and social services of all types.

A much more dependent mentality among our citizens. We have grown soft as a nation. It is our first impulse to expect something more from the government. We are used to service everywhere.
Entitlements, rights and the me first mentality describe us more than ever.

We are losing our faith as a nation. Like it or not we were founded as Judeo-Christian nation with
those values as our underpinning. Today it's about self. Whatever makes one feel good- go for it. My personal belief is that we are losing God's blessing. Go ahead and slaughter me for that.

The Congress has grown into a cynical body that is totally politics first. This may not be new in the last 30 or so years but it certainly seems worse. I see very little representation of America's interests being shown there. That's probably the only bi-partisan effort I see. Why has this happened? Because we reward it. We vote for the known face or the pork deliverer with tenure and power.

We offer a free high school education and completing high school has a huge predictive value on success in society. Far to many reject the opportunity and become net drains on society. Why? The family structure is breaking apart. Our values are weak. We are not teaching discipline and respect in the home or at school. And our public schools are generally not challenging, creative or exciting.

We are completely into self entertainment. That means even our news has to be entertaining. It doesn't matter if it's factual or probing. Just keep it fast paced and sexy.

Who's at fault? Not the President. It's me, you, us. All of us. We let it get to this point. We are not proud of our country anymore, we just want more services from it. We don't consider ourselves exceptional so we live and play like an average team.

So why have I been so hard on Obama on this site? After all it's not his fault. Indeed where we are is a product of 30 + years of abuse just as one of our wise posters said the other day. Why on the other hand did I give Bush a pass?

I guess it's because I blame us for what is happening and I look to the President only to set a tone for our direction, to give us inspiration to be what we have been and can be. We collectively voted for what is happening now.

I am looking for a President to say:

We are exceptional as a nation
We reward success and we allow bad behavior to fail
We value faith as the cornerstone of our nation
We are a leader in a fairly dark world. The world is not morally equivalent. We have a job to lead and to help the opressed of the world. We avoid war if possible, but we do fight for freedom.
We value free markets and competition as the drive of our society's success.
We don't participate in class envy on the one end or racism on another. We want people to be successful. Rather than tear their effort down - how can we free them up to help more be successful?
We don't ask for more from our government, rather we ask for less. Give us security. Equality of opportunity not equality of result. The government will not pick winners and losers.

So again- why did I give Bush such a free pass? I gave him the benefit of the doubt for passing most of the above tests in terms of attitude. He was a poor communicator and he overspent and he is complicit in where we stand today. However, I think he believed in American exceptionalism, democracy, free markets, liberty and faith. I view Bush, not as smart in ways men value today, but rather wise in a throwback sort of way no longer valued.

Why am I so hard on Obama? I see a smarter, sharper man leading us in an ideological direction that is not America at all. I don't see him making technical mistakes like Bush. I see him single mindedly moving towards globalism, moral equivalency, a faithless, government dependent society that is more socialistic than the one we have known. I see a President that just doesn't share the traditional values of America. Competition, strength, free markets, individual liberty and faith. It's not Obama's fault where we are. He is merely a symbol and a director of what we voted for. What he is doing now was entirely predictable- it's the change we asked for and have been asking for for years.

We can still stop this if we have the will.

UpnorthGo4
12-29-2009, 10:54 AM
Great post, Beej. I agree with almost everything you said. Your last sentence is the only thing you have wrong. There is no WE in America anymore. I believe our country is irretrievably breaking apart into religious and secular, liberal and conservative, citizen and non-citizen, educated and uneducated, rich and poor, and tolerant and intolerant. Whatever may come in the future, there are two things we know for certain: (1) America will never again be the country it once was, or what we now think it should be; and (2) Americans will never again be able to live their lives with any degree of confidence that children will have it better than their parents.

bga1
12-29-2009, 11:20 AM
Thanks Upnorth. You may be right. However, I think we have to at least think in terms of it being possible or it's over with for the world.

The world, without America as it was this past 100 years, would be almost unimaginably worse.
As we turn ourselves over to globalism we need to think of the world without a leader such as America. Sad indeed.

I, personally, am ashamed at what I and my generation will leave behind- just as you said.

jamiche
12-30-2009, 10:34 AM
Thanks Upnorth. You may be right. However, I think we have to at least think in terms of it being possible or it's over with for the world.

The world, without America as it was this past 100 years, would be almost unimaginably worse.
As we turn ourselves over to globalism we need to think of the world without a leader such as America. Sad indeed.

I, personally, am ashamed at what I and my generation will leave behind- just as you said.

I think you are being to much of a Gloomy Gus, beej. The only constant in life is change and countries, like companies and organizations, that don't change, die. Most, though not all, of the changes in this country are positive. In the last 20-30 years women and minorities have gained seats at the table. The country is generally more tolerant, which means that it is more moral and humane. We are by no means post race or racism but public or private discrimination is no longer acceptable. Crime is down to 1960's levels. I go to LA several times a year and the air is consistently cleaner than it was thirty years ago.

The explosion in the access to information has changed everyone's life. My children have a much bigger world and so many more opportunities than I had at their age. People are earning money doing things that didn't exist ten years ago.

Geopolitically, we are still the alpha dog though we are going to have to regard China as an equal very soon. The sleeping giant woke up. They will have their own growth pains to deal with.

This isn't meant to be pollyannish because there are dark sides to all of these changes. But that's life. My parents survived the Depression and WWII, we survived the 70's and the country will survive these tough times.

bga1
12-30-2009, 11:12 AM
I think you are being to much of a Gloomy Gus, beej. The only constant in life is change and countries, like companies and organizations, that don't change, die. Most, though not all, of the changes in this country are positive. In the last 20-30 years women and minorities have gained seats at the table. The country is generally more tolerant, which means that it is more moral and humane. We are by no means post race or racism but public or private discrimination is no longer acceptable. Crime is down to 1960's levels. I go to LA several times a year and the air is consistently cleaner than it was thirty years ago.

The explosion in the access to information has changed everyone's life. My children have a much bigger world and so many more opportunities than I had at their age. People are earning money doing things that didn't exist ten years ago.

Geopolitically, we are still the alpha dog though we are going to have to regard China as an equal very soon. The sleeping giant woke up. They will have their own growth pains to deal with.

This isn't meant to be pollyannish because there are dark sides to all of these changes. But that's life. My parents survived the Depression and WWII, we survived the 70's and the country will survive these tough times.

You say some great things in there Jamiche and I agree with many. One point of clarity- at least in my view- tolerance does not vary directly with morality. To the degree that we have become less racist and less sexist- then yes these are areas where tolerance = morality. In areas where we have decided that tolerance means "anything goes" that does not equal morality. In fact the idea of tolerance has become to some degree a religion of it's own which is anti-faith and anti moral standards. In this area we have gone backwards and lost our compass. This is part of where we have lost the family- the most vital structure we have.

There is hope- but only if we turn from the direction we are now heading. We have a 200 year plus record of flawed but unparalleled success as a nation. This success is founded in principals that we are now inexplicably running away from. If we turn back to God and back to personal responsiblity we will boom again.

I'm not so worried about China as I am about us. China has a rotten core and they will either install more freedom and democracy or they will damage themselves. Their "success" is at the expense of essentially slave labor.

Winnipegopher
12-30-2009, 12:07 PM
I am a firm believer that the next superpower will be India and not China. India has a huge educated, population base and much more experience with the outside world as well as a history of democracy.

jamiche
12-30-2009, 01:26 PM
You say some great things in there Jamiche and I agree with many. One point of clarity- at least in my view- tolerance does not vary directly with morality. To the degree that we have become less racist and less sexist- then yes these are areas where tolerance = morality. In areas where we have decided that tolerance means "anything goes" that does not equal morality. In fact the idea of tolerance has become to some degree a religion of it's own which is anti-faith and anti moral standards. In this area we have gone backwards and lost our compass. This is part of where we have lost the family- the most vital structure we have.

There is hope- but only if we turn from the direction we are now heading. We have a 200 year plus record of flawed but unparalleled success as a nation. This success is founded in principals that we are now inexplicably running away from. If we turn back to God and back to personal responsiblity we will boom again.

I'm not so worried about China as I am about us. China has a rotten core and they will either install more freedom and democracy or they will damage themselves. Their "success" is at the expense of essentially slave labor.

If anything, there is less of an "anything goes" environment today than a generation ago. I was telling someone at lunch today that when I was in high school it was common knowledge that four teachers (one female) were sleeping with students. Today those teachers would go to jail. Roman Polanski was offered 45 days for raping a 13 year old girl in 1977, today he would get 45 years. Think about the three strikes and your out policies in NY and, I think, CA.

Do you know anyone who doesn't believe in personal responsibility?

I think some of what you express is your discomfort, in code, that gay people can be more open, in some states marry, in most states adopt children. Maybe these are families that are different from yours and mine, but they are just as valid. The growth of "non traditional" families has not harmed the moral fiber of the country.

And yes, teenagers have sex. We had sex at that age so why should kids today be any different?

bga1
12-30-2009, 02:22 PM
<"Do you know anyone who doesn't believe in personal responsibility?">

Yeah - Most of the people that want free health care. Most of the people in jail. People that are "sue happy". Anyone that thinks they can continue to behave poorly and go collect their welfare check. Anyone that is a net recipient from the government and still complains that they don't get enough. On the other end of the spectrum is a very, very small number who do a great disservice to society by greedily taking far too much from corporations and giving back little. This 1/10th of 1% is the percentage of society we really like to bash. They deserve it, but they are but a small part of the number who don't believe or at least only give lip service to personal responsibility.

jamiche
12-30-2009, 05:21 PM
<"Do you know anyone who doesn't believe in personal responsibility?">

Yeah - Most of the people that want free health care. Most of the people in jail. People that are "sue happy". Anyone that thinks they can continue to behave poorly and go collect their welfare check. Anyone that is a net recipient from the government and still complains that they don't get enough. On the other end of the spectrum is a very, very small number who do a great disservice to society by greedily taking far too much from corporations and giving back little. This 1/10th of 1% is the percentage of society we really like to bash. They deserve it, but they are but a small part of the number who don't believe or at least only give lip service to personal responsibility.

They may be .1% of the population but the dollar amounts are gargantuan. It takes a lot of welfare queens (not including Goldman Sachs) and petty thieves to equal the damage done by Madoff and Petters alone.

As you know, because you are a smart businessman, the damage goes well beyond the preceding examples.

Friend Of Tubby
12-30-2009, 05:54 PM
Recession = your neighbor loses his/her job.

Depression = you lose your job.

Recovery = Obama loses his job.